Sometimes, I just don't understand the WIS pricing system. Scouting ahead for a progressive, I noticed these two years of Jose Vidro.

G PA H HR RBI R SB SO BB AVG OBP SLG
2001 Montreal Expos 2B 124 531 155 15 59 82 4 49 31 .319 .371 .486 B/D $3.93M
2002 Montreal Expos 2B 152 681 190 19 96 103 2 70 60 .315 .378 .490 B+/B $6.30M

Am I missing something, or are they suggesting that 150 PA and improved range are worth $2.37M? Everything else important looks virtually the same.

Range, especially for modern era players is absolutely rediculously high priced. It's to the point where modern A+ range players are often times unusable.

The 2002 version has approximately 30% more PA's...making the adjustment puts the 2001 version at around $5.1M. The defense makes up the $1.2M difference in price it seems.

Would anyone really spend 6.3M on the 2002 version? There are so many better values out there. Has anyone done any research to guesstimate if good range is anywhere near worth the cost? From my perspective, it's absurd, but maybe that's why I've done so poorly on my OLs since the last update.

If you comp the stats closely, the differential works out. The `02 Vidro has 28% more PA, so that extrapolates to 28% more salary or another $1.1 MM. The bump from B to B+ fielding is worth maybe $100,000. Figure that the jump from range of D to B -- six places on a D, D+, C-, C, C+, B- and B system -- is worth about $600,000.

The 2% bump from .371 to .378 OBP is worth another $100,000 or $200,000 and the increase in power implied by the RBI (96 v. 59, which probably means quite a few more extra base hits) is proportionately greatly than the direct extrapolation of 28% more PA. So you can get from $3.93 MM to $6.30 MM on a strict interpretation of the numbers.

Having said that, mattedesa is right. Who wants to pay $6.30 MM for `02 Jose Vidro? I can't think of too many ballparks or lineup configurations in which he is worth more than comparably priced `23 Rogers Hornsby, `11 Eddie Collins, `52 Jackie Robinson and `01 Roberto Alomar, to name just a few.

Quote: Originally Posted By mattedesa on 4/06/2010Would anyone really spend 6.3M on the 2002 version? There are so many better values out there. Has anyone done any research to guesstimate if good range is anywhere near worth the cost? From my perspective, it's absurd, but maybe that's why I've done so poorly on my OLs since the last update

Old-time high range, low fielding percentage guys seem worth the cost if you have the right pitching.

Quote: Originally Posted By beaneball on 4/06/2010Range, especially for modern era players is absolutely rediculously high priced. It's to the point where modern A+ range players are often times unusable

I am not completely sure yet, but A+ range only seems overpriced (to me) on A-A+ fielders mostly because unless you are using 1885-1886 pitchers you aren't maximizing the value of those high fielding percentages.

Quote: Originally Posted By thunder1008 on 4/06/2010
If you comp the stats closely, the differential works out. The `02 Vidro has 28% more PA, so that extrapolates to 28% more salary or another $1.1 MM. The bump from B to B+ fielding is worth maybe $100,000. Figure that the jump from range of D to B -- six places on a D, D+, C-, C, C+, B- and B system -- is worth about $600,000.

The 2% bump from .371 to .378 OBP is worth another $100,000 or $200,000 and the increase in power implied by the RBI (96 v. 59, which probably means quite a few more extra base hits) is proportionately greatly than the direct extrapolation of 28% more PA. So you can get from $3.93 MM to $6.30 MM on a strict interpretation of the numbers.

Having said that, mattedesa is right. Who wants to pay $6.30 MM for `02 Jose Vidro? I can't think of too many ballparks or lineup configurations in which he is worth more than comparably priced `23 Rogers Hornsby, `11 Eddie Collins, `52 Jackie Robinson and `01 Roberto Alomar, to name just a few.

This is patently untrue. If you actually look at his numbers, the numbers of XBH are almost exactly the same.

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Heck, I'd never take Jose Vidro just on principle and how badly he sucked for the Mariners.

Also, note that the OBP for Vidro doesn't tell the whole story. In 2002, Vidro had 60 BBs in 681 PAs, and in 2001 he had only 31 BBs in 531 PAs. His OBP in 2002 also reflects 14 sacrifice hits/flies vs. only 4 in 2001.