D II recruiting question Topic

mduncanhogs
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I'm new to D II and am curious how to best go about recruiting to a D II school.  Can D I players be pulled down to D II like D II players can be pulled down to D III?  If not, is it best to be more patient with recruiting at D II to see if D I players will drop down?  Lastly, with the bigger budget, is it a bit easier to recruit further away from campus or should you still try to stay close by?

Thanks
12/15/2010 8:18 AM
_hannibal_
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DII recruiting is not significantly different from DIII recruiting.  You can still pull down, have drop downs.  One difference is that internationals are now an option.  Distance isn't a major factor if you avoid battles.  One thing that has apparently changed since I was at DII is that you can reach up a little further into DI and you will have more low DI schools going after the same pool of recruits the DII schools are after.
12/15/2010 10:52 AM
ethan66
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Welcome to HD, mduncanhogs! 

Some of your questions are answered in this FAQ: whatifsports.com/hd/help/guide.aspx#recruiting

Of course, general guidelines are not the same as real experience.  My own limited experience in D2 tells me that it's very tough to actively pull D1 players down to D2.  Your budget is limited enough already that the money is better spent on players at the D2 level.  

But your question about patience is also important: usually, by the 2nd or 3d day of the recruiting session, I see D1 players dropping to D2.  If I've already committed myself to other recruits, it's very tough to switch targets and go all-out without running the risk of going broke.  So yes, patience patience, patience :)  But in my experience, it's better to let them come down to you rather than try to lure them down.  It's just more efficient budget-wise.

I'm probably not the one to answer your question about distance.  I watch other top D2 programs during & after recruiting, and I see some that are able to recruit nationally.  I suspect that in many cases, they have (1) high prestige (2) chase 1 or 2 distant recruits and several locals.   Personally, I don't have that kind of budget or prestige yet.  I do most of my searching within 1000 mi of campus for now.  I expect that a season will arrive when I have higher prestige and spot a good player that I need, and I can sacrifice a little quality on the rest of my class to get that one standout kid.  Until then I'm recruiting for future potential, mostly, and staying local.

Your mileage may vary.



12/15/2010 10:58 AM
brip87
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Posted by _hannibal_ on 12/15/2010 10:52:00 AM (view original):
DII recruiting is not significantly different from DIII recruiting.  You can still pull down, have drop downs.  One difference is that internationals are now an option.  Distance isn't a major factor if you avoid battles.  One thing that has apparently changed since I was at DII is that you can reach up a little further into DI and you will have more low DI schools going after the same pool of recruits the DII schools are after.
I find distance is more important for the good players.  If a d1 team wants them and its far from you it is not a choice you cant battle but if there close to you then you can. 
12/15/2010 11:14 AM
jbob23
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I wouldn't pull anyone down unless it's within the signing period until you have a B prestige. Once you have a B prestige or greater I would pull recruits down just before the signing period. Always go after division I dropdowns and never settle for division II recruits unless someone has great potential and good cores. It's hard to pull more then two recruits down because of money so be smart with who you choose.
12/15/2010 11:34 AM
brip87
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Posted by jbob23 on 12/15/2010 11:34:00 AM (view original):
I wouldn't pull anyone down unless it's within the signing period until you have a B prestige. Once you have a B prestige or greater I would pull recruits down just before the signing period. Always go after division I dropdowns and never settle for division II recruits unless someone has great potential and good cores. It's hard to pull more then two recruits down because of money so be smart with who you choose.
This is just false.  Pull downs can be done at any prestige.
12/15/2010 1:11 PM
johnfoppe
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Agree with brip here.  Of course the quality of the pulldown might not be as good at a lower prestige school, but you can certainly do it.  Pretty much 80% of my recruits are pull downs with the other 20 being drop downs and the occasional transfer.   Patience is important, unfortunately I have none.   I try to stay within 360 miles.  Much cheaper that way.
12/15/2010 3:16 PM
ryrun
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And, if you stay within that 360 mile threshold especially, you can easily pull down more than two recruits.

Say, for example, you're looking at guys 200 miles away - an eval is going to cost somewhere around $180-$200 per.  Popular belief is that a pull down takes about 10-15 evals (most of the time, sometimes more apparently) and a scholarship.  So, with that, you're looking at anywhere from $2-3,000 for a pull down - and you get $5k per open scholarship at D2 (plus carryover/tourney money hopefully).

While it is risky, it is definitely worth the risk as long as you pick your battles and don't blow up a 6 man class or something.
12/15/2010 4:06 PM
coach_billyg
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Posted by ryrun on 12/15/2010 4:06:00 PM (view original):
And, if you stay within that 360 mile threshold especially, you can easily pull down more than two recruits.

Say, for example, you're looking at guys 200 miles away - an eval is going to cost somewhere around $180-$200 per.  Popular belief is that a pull down takes about 10-15 evals (most of the time, sometimes more apparently) and a scholarship.  So, with that, you're looking at anywhere from $2-3,000 for a pull down - and you get $5k per open scholarship at D2 (plus carryover/tourney money hopefully).

While it is risky, it is definitely worth the risk as long as you pick your battles and don't blow up a 6 man class or something.
and when you do blow up the 6 man class, what you learned along the way is probably worth 10 times as much as what you lost by blowing up the class :)
12/15/2010 6:54 PM
brip87
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Im kinda mentoring this coach and have given him all the info I know about recruiting.  I am alos letting him do things his way.  I dont tell him what to do just how it is possible.  He needs to learn what a good player is etc.  But the majority of the best players are pull downs and if he want them then he needs to pull them down.  Its a high risk high reward situation.
12/15/2010 6:57 PM
jbob23
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Posted by brip87 on 12/15/2010 1:11:00 PM (view original):
Posted by jbob23 on 12/15/2010 11:34:00 AM (view original):
I wouldn't pull anyone down unless it's within the signing period until you have a B prestige. Once you have a B prestige or greater I would pull recruits down just before the signing period. Always go after division I dropdowns and never settle for division II recruits unless someone has great potential and good cores. It's hard to pull more then two recruits down because of money so be smart with who you choose.
This is just false.  Pull downs can be done at any prestige.
I never said you couldn't do them, I said I wouldn't. There is a good reason for this, someone could easily take them from you and then you have blown your money. I also said I wouldn't do them until the signing period at a lower prestige. This will make it so you can sign the kid if nobody has already gotten involved without much risk.
12/15/2010 9:45 PM
jbob23
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Posted by ryrun on 12/15/2010 4:06:00 PM (view original):
And, if you stay within that 360 mile threshold especially, you can easily pull down more than two recruits.

Say, for example, you're looking at guys 200 miles away - an eval is going to cost somewhere around $180-$200 per.  Popular belief is that a pull down takes about 10-15 evals (most of the time, sometimes more apparently) and a scholarship.  So, with that, you're looking at anywhere from $2-3,000 for a pull down - and you get $5k per open scholarship at D2 (plus carryover/tourney money hopefully).

While it is risky, it is definitely worth the risk as long as you pick your battles and don't blow up a 6 man class or something.

If your in an area with that many good low division I recruits then yes maybe you can pull ALL your recruits down. Of course that means no other teams are going after your guys and you have a big class to fill. I find it much easier to identify one or two guys to pull down and have the rest drop down. If I had a six man class to fill I would go for three pull downs. Everything comes down to how close you are to the really good players and if there is competition with other schools.

12/15/2010 9:50 PM
D II recruiting question Topic
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