Talk about sucky.

Yes, there are a few good prospects available, but I was stunned to see how many alleged "D1 prospects" are ranked that actually have miserable ratings and potentials.  In fact, this may be the first cycle I've seen in my short HD career where I'm finding non-pulldown D2s who are actually better prospects than the D1 guys.

I thought maybe it was just my usual narrow scouting area, so I added 2 states this season and it's still true - how about a SG with mediocre speed and low potential; low (37) DEF and low potential; mediocre PER and low potential? And he's ranked #180?  By the time he's a senior he might be a backup player on an above-average team.  And that's just one example of several.

Did all the good high school players go to Europe or something?

For one thing, rankings are based entirely on current ratings, with no consideration whatsoever for potential.  So that means that trying to make an argument against a ranking based on a players potentials is a nonsensical exercise.  If the guys has decent starting BH/Pass and the mediocre speed and PER, I can see him being ranked, even with bad defense.  And if you aren't seeing quality players in the D2 pool on a regular basis, you aren't looking hard enough.

Posted by dahsdebater on 8/16/2011 7:55:00 PM (view original):
For one thing, rankings are based entirely on current ratings, with no consideration whatsoever for potential.  So that means that trying to make an argument against a ranking based on a players potentials is a nonsensical exercise.  If the guys has decent starting BH/Pass and the mediocre speed and PER, I can see him being ranked, even with bad defense.  And if you aren't seeing quality players in the D2 pool on a regular basis, you aren't looking hard enough.

I take exception to that, Dahs.  I've found quality players - I mentioned that I've found several D2 recruits already -  and my scouting has covered 4 states and hundreds of players.  I think I know what I'm doing by now, so yes I'm "looking hard enough".

The point was that, usually, D1 pulldowns have generally higher quality in both raw ratings and potential - or at least they have in the past.  For some reason, this cycle I'm finding that not to be the case.  The vast majority of the pulldowns within about 500 miles are ranked, to start with, which means my chances at D2 of getting them are somewhere around nil.  And most of those ranked players have crappy combinations of ratings and potentials that not even a mediocre D2 program like mine wants to spend money to land.

Here's an other example:  A ranked C.  47 ATH (high); 16 SPD (high); 56 REB (Average); 61 DEF (low); block and LP both in the 40s with low potential; 14 PER (high);  68 WE - he might make a decent Sim D2 recruit, but a ranked D1 player?  You gotta be kidding me.

As dahs said, player ranking has always been based on current rating, with no regard to potential. Nothing has changed between this month and last month, or the month before that. What you are seeing now is probably a poor recruiting generation (in terms of potential) of recruits in your region.

Posted by tianyi7886 on 8/17/2011 12:06:00 AM (view original):
As dahs said, player ranking has always been based on current rating, with no regard to potential. Nothing has changed between this month and last month, or the month before that. What you are seeing now is probably a poor recruiting generation (in terms of potential) of recruits in your region.

That makes sense.  Potential aside, the ranked players I'm seeing really aren't that good in terms of raw ratings (below about #77 or 80, that is).

Since I haven't been able to touch those guys since the 2/3 update, it's not really a factor for me anyway.  I'll carry on with my little D2 recruits and make the best of things :)

Posted by tianyi7886 on 8/17/2011 12:06:00 AM (view original):
As dahs said, player ranking has always been based on current rating, with no regard to potential. Nothing has changed between this month and last month, or the month before that. What you are seeing now is probably a poor recruiting generation (in terms of potential) of recruits in your region.

Agreed. Just an unlucky batch of recruits for you.

Could be a combination of poor geographic recruit generation and possibly a smaller overall recruit pool than in some other seasons.  The number of recruits generated is a function of the number of openings.  If you happen to have a season where some things line up and the number of recruits generated is less than normal, then the rankings will go to lesser players since less players means less top-tiered players.  If you have any stored data on it you could compare the number of starred players to the normal numbers.

I keep enough spreadsheets as is, dahs :)

But basically it's probably just that I'm stuck in the middle of western Texas.  I should get discounts on Mexican international players :)

You aren't getting the good ones because I am gobbling them all up ethan66!  ;-)  Seriously though, I have Texas scouted too and the recruits there suck this year for DII, nothing like wasting a thousand bucks scouting a state of 263 prospects only to find that there are 2-3 players tops who you would want on your team. 

That was my other conspiracy theory, Kekionga -  I knew someone was out for me! :)

I would hate to be a D3 team in Texas with the scouting costs for the state.  This season was the closest I've come to actually exercising patience and waiting for a drop down from a more talent-rich area.  I'm just afraid if Texas sucks this bad, other states are going to feel more recruiting pressure.  So I played "vulture" and said "screw patience, let's kill something".   Can't say I'm psyched about my players but I think I'll be ok.

I was one of the whiners when Sebs changed the way ranked recruits work.  Prior to the update, I actually landed a ranked player when I had a D+ prestige.  That guy (Jones) will be a senior this year and I don't expect to ever land another ranked guy unless they change the rules again.  And there goes about 3/4 of the D1 pulldown prospects in my area.

Here's hoping the talent gets back next season.  I have a couple of key player I need to replace if I want to keep rolling.

Looking forward to our non-con game this season!

You can get the ranked guys, you just need to send out a ridiculous amount of phone calls to see which ones will drop.  And of course NT appearances increases the likelihood that you can as well.  A friend of mine with a B- prestige is getting some ranked play this cycle, so it's possible. 

Why are you so fixated on taking down ranked players? I have only recruited one ranked guys in my 3 seasons so far in Rupp D2, and the team is doing quite well.

That's good to hear, FW.  The mood around here has been pretty pessimistic on D2s pulling down ranked guys, though it can be done. 

The whole reason I started this thread, though, was because I wasn't even seeing ranked guys who were worth the additional effort over some of the vanilla D2 players I found.

Last season was my first NT appearance so I'm hoping my fortunes change if I can become a regular.  I have a couple of good human-coached rivals in Lone Star, but it's heavy on Sim teams so I positively have to bump my non-con SOS if I want to make the NT field every year.  Guys like you are helping me out and I thank you for that.

Posted by tianyi7886 on 8/17/2011 10:22:00 AM (view original):
Why are you so fixated on taking down ranked players? I have only recruited one ranked guys in my 3 seasons so far in Rupp D2, and the team is doing quite well.

At least in this cycle in DII Smith in the southwest where we both recruit, it seems that nearly 80-90% of the good DII players (490-520 overall to start) are all ranked players, and the ones who are lesser rated don't have great potentials.  It is just a bad year.