To steal from espn and mike and mike. The BSpn translator to wis response.....we have no freaking clue how that happened, have no time to figure it out, would risk a slippery slope if we corrected this obvious error, so, you are out of luck bud.


When only you have access to the code, its always convenient to day...that was the intended result.rather than admit errors

Posted by alblack56 on 2/16/2012 7:45:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mbalding on 2/16/2012 1:01:00 PM (view original):
Conference strength went down, but nobody else's prestige in the conference seemed to be affected by it that I saw.

 Here is the response to the ticket.

Please review the thorough, detailed analysis covering prestige as outlined in KB article 779:

http://www.whatifsports.com/knowledgebase/KB_Article_Details.aspx?kbid=779

I knew they'd ignore you. WIS is so good about dealing with other problems but is very stubborn about team prestige.   There's probably not 10% of the coaches who like the way it's structured.

I think the blow-offiness of that response isn't actually about prestige.  When I've submitted tickets, that's often the type of response I get.  I just respond the the BS message repeating and supporting my question.  They pay attention after that.

As an aside, I used to run a technical support group.  This is SOP.  You give the boilerplate first because that really will answer about 95% of the questions you're asked.  When the customer says, "No, seriously, guys..." and clearly isn't a dummy,* you take him or her seriously.  It's suboptimal for the customer but it's optimal for the support group.  You'll get the response you need eventually.  It just may not be one you like.

*Most customers are dummies.  The forum posters aren't a representative sample of the customer base - far fewer dummies.

That's pretty much the answer I've received every single time I've ever submitted a ticket on prestige.  For whatever reason, that's an issue the developers think runs pretty darn well in the game when it clearly doesn't.  They've also indicated they'll never get rid of the effect conference prestige has on an individual school despite its obvious flaws. 

Posted by jslotman on 2/17/2012 9:57:00 AM (view original):
That's pretty much the answer I've received every single time I've ever submitted a ticket on prestige.  For whatever reason, that's an issue the developers think runs pretty darn well in the game when it clearly doesn't.  They've also indicated they'll never get rid of the effect conference prestige has on an individual school despite its obvious flaws. 

In fairness, conference prestige should absolutely impact team prestige. Some schools are unaffected by the conference but others certainly are. The lower level schools in a power conference will often times get guys who are actually good enough to go to better programs, but decide they'd rather be the man on say a Miami, rather than be the 4th best player at UNC. Whereas if Miami was in say Conference USA, that same player wouldn't even consider them.

I cannot disagree more with the theory that a single team or small group of teams has that big of an effect on an entire conference in the real world.  The bottom falls out on plenty of teams in BCS conferences in basketball whilst other teams are winning the NCAA"s or otherwise having successful seasons.  And Miami can't be the example you wanted to cite as precisely one McDonald's All American has chosen Miami in the real world since Miami joined a BCS conference (Darius Rice).  Wouldn't more talented players have chosen Miami over the years because they were playing UNC and Duke or Syracuse and Connecticut because the success of those teams surely would have kept the prestige of Miami high enough to attract quality recruits, right?  (I also note that in many seasons, the fourth best player at UNC or Duke is also an All-American, so the comparison is apt.) 

HD would have us believe that Big Six conference teams can never really stink for years on end simply because they're playing in a Big Six conference.  The real world truly does not bear out that theory (I point to DePaul, Oregon State, Iowa State, Washington State, St. John's, Seton Hall, Providence, and many others as good examples). 

There should definitely be a conference impact on team prestige, but right now it is too strong and poorly executed. Instead of being like steroids to boost up poorly performing or downright mediocre teams to ridiculously high prestiges, perhaps it should simply help prevent them from falling below some minimum prestige. Big 6 conferences are definitely more alluring to most recruits than some mid-major conference that never gets on TV and isn't playing in front of big crowds against top-flight competition. Indiana has run circles around Butler in recruiting the past two seasons, despite Butler being in back-to-back title games, and IU being basically irrelevant.

FYI the Big East is still listed as having A- conference prestige, which is the highest of any conference.  So I dont think conference prestige can be blamed for team dropping in prestige.

Posted by jslotman on 2/17/2012 11:16:00 AM (view original):
I cannot disagree more with the theory that a single team or small group of teams has that big of an effect on an entire conference in the real world.  The bottom falls out on plenty of teams in BCS conferences in basketball whilst other teams are winning the NCAA"s or otherwise having successful seasons.  And Miami can't be the example you wanted to cite as precisely one McDonald's All American has chosen Miami in the real world since Miami joined a BCS conference (Darius Rice).  Wouldn't more talented players have chosen Miami over the years because they were playing UNC and Duke or Syracuse and Connecticut because the success of those teams surely would have kept the prestige of Miami high enough to attract quality recruits, right?  (I also note that in many seasons, the fourth best player at UNC or Duke is also an All-American, so the comparison is apt.) 

HD would have us believe that Big Six conference teams can never really stink for years on end simply because they're playing in a Big Six conference.  The real world truly does not bear out that theory (I point to DePaul, Oregon State, Iowa State, Washington State, St. John's, Seton Hall, Providence, and many others as good examples). 

No a single team does not make a conference, the history of a conference makes the conference appealing. I'm not saying UNC makes players want to play in the ACC, the success the ACC has had makes players want to play in the ACC. The exposure the conference gets, same goes for the Big East, being in these conferences just gets you exposure that you don't get at smaller confernces. Ignoring that fact is naive to the way things really work.

This game does not work in a way where schools in BCS conferences are incapable of being bad for long periods, just look in any world you will see many examples of BCS schools who have been bad for a while. Saying that it does work like that in HD is just ignoring the facts.

Another thing is, getting a McDonald's AA isn't the only measure of getting a great player. There are many guys who aren't All-Americans but end up being great college players, and are very highly recruited. Only 24 guys are selected for the McDonald's game, so let's say it's the top 24 guys (which it isn't), the 25th best player in the country is somebody who is extremely highly recruited, so is the 50th best guy. A school like Miami, by virtue of being in the ACC could sign the 33rd best player, who they may have had no chance of getting had they been in a smaller conference.

Posted by professor17 on 2/17/2012 11:33:00 AM (view original):
There should definitely be a conference impact on team prestige, but right now it is too strong and poorly executed. Instead of being like steroids to boost up poorly performing or downright mediocre teams to ridiculously high prestiges, perhaps it should simply help prevent them from falling below some minimum prestige. Big 6 conferences are definitely more alluring to most recruits than some mid-major conference that never gets on TV and isn't playing in front of big crowds against top-flight competition. Indiana has run circles around Butler in recruiting the past two seasons, despite Butler being in back-to-back title games, and IU being basically irrelevant.

+1

I think it should definitely act like a floor and tie it to the conference's prestige in that world.  Perhaps no school can be more than 2 letter grades below the conference prestige.