I'm going to pick on MetsMax.   Let me begin by saying, Mets is a good coach.  He has Maryland in the ACC in Knight with me and he's a great guy.   But how in the world has he not been fired at Kentucky in Phelan?

26	metsmax	7-20	5-6	2-13	0-1	3-13		220	B
25	metsmax	15-14	6-3	9-10	0-1	9-7		78	B	PI (2nd Round)
24	metsmax	19-12	10-3	9-7	0-2	8-8		54	B	PI (Final Four)
23	metsmax	15-13	9-4	5-8	1-1	7-9		98	B-
22	metsmax	13-14	6-5	7-8	0-1	7-9		152	B
21	metsmax	21-9	14-3	7-5	0-1	12-4		58	B	Conf Champion PI (3rd Round)
20	metsmax	15-14	7-6	7-7	1-1	9-7		88	B-	PI (1st Round)
19	metsmax	15-12	5-6	10-5	0-1	7-9		99	B-
18	metsmax	8-20	3-8	4-11	1-1	4-12		179	B-
17	metsmax	15-16	8-3	4-12	3-1	6-10		73	B-	PI (1st Round)
16	metsmax	15-13	8-3	6-9	1-1	8-8		92	B-
15	metsmax	10-17	6-5	4-11	0-1	5-11		139	B-
14	metsmax	9-18	2-10	7-7	0-1	6-10		176	B-
13	metsmax	13-14	9-7	4-6	0-1	7-9		156	B-

NO WAY this record flies in bluegrass country.  Other coaches want and deserve this incredible job (not necessarily me, I suspect I wouldn't get it if it opened up anyway).   What is the criteria for getting fired?  Also, if it's not higher for the real blue chip B- bottom prestige jobs like Kentucky, Kansas, UNC, Duke, Arizona, etc., then shouldn't it be?

I recently submitted a ticket asking the above question using metsmax as an example.  I was told "firings do happen. It depends on the expectations of the school.  The higher the expectations, the quicker someone will get fired for not meeting them. But we give a coach plenty of opportunity to keep his job."  

It seems that in practice it works sort of the opposite.  I've seen coaches get fired in 6 seasons at the non-elite schools, but it seems like once you make an elite school you get 8-9 seasons before canning. But I've not looked real closely.

if you havent made the NT in that long with an elite you should be fired

despite the fact ive been fired several times avoiding getting fired is fairly easy, often as simple as just making sure at least once every 3 seasons or so you increase your wins and/or rpi from the previous season. this isn't an exact example, but the premise works, just check out what ive done with vandy in allen for decades

firings are complete crap. the coach at kentucky before me in tark was even worse. i honestly think i should be fired by now, in real life i probably would be, or maybe next season would be my last chance at redemption. but the guy before me, i was told by CS, was saved from being fired in season 7 *because he finally made the PIT in season 6* after missing the post season the first 5 seasons. then had to miss the post season 3 more times after making the PIT before getting fired. really? making the PIT bought the UK coach 3 more seasons of no post season? NIT = fired, in wildcat country. you might get one, if you have otherwise done a great job. getting saved by the PIT is insulting to me and every other fan of the sport.

Well said billyg     

i hope they fix it eventually. i don't blame the new regime, they had/have bigger fish to fry, but i hope in like 6 months or so they will give it a look over.

I think it's important to keep in mind that each world in HD is a separate imaginary universe.  They may have started out being intended replicas of schools in the real world, but once the world gets started it loses all connection with the real world.  That's part of the beauty of HD, we can make a no name school a prestigious desired institution if we have the skill and so choose to do so.  We can turn any school in to this world's Gonzaga and prestigious schools in real life don't have to reflect that prestige in HD worlds.

Not true, greener.

Posted by greener on 7/14/2010 3:02:00 PM (view original):
I think it's important to keep in mind that each world in HD is a separate imaginary universe.  They may have started out being intended replicas of schools in the real world, but once the world gets started it loses all connection with the real world.  That's part of the beauty of HD, we can make a no name school a prestigious desired institution if we have the skill and so choose to do so.  We can turn any school in to this world's Gonzaga and prestigious schools in real life don't have to reflect that prestige in HD worlds.

greener, this is true in D2 and D3.  Unfortunately, it's completely untrue in D1.  HD's static baseline prestige system effectively limits how far a D1 power conference school can fall, and how far a non-power conference school can rise.  I would argue that it's nearly impossible to build a Gonzaga with static baseline prestige implemented.  If I won the NT at Miami (OH) the next 2 seasons, my prestige (which is currently a B) would not rise above an A-.  That is truly sad in my opinion.  To be fair, this is not a new engine issue - it's existed for some time. 

Posted by muredskin00 on 7/14/2010 3:56:00 PM (view original):

Posted by greener on 7/14/2010 3:02:00 PM (view original):
I think it's important to keep in mind that each world in HD is a separate imaginary universe.  They may have started out being intended replicas of schools in the real world, but once the world gets started it loses all connection with the real world.  That's part of the beauty of HD, we can make a no name school a prestigious desired institution if we have the skill and so choose to do so.  We can turn any school in to this world's Gonzaga and prestigious schools in real life don't have to reflect that prestige in HD worlds.

greener, this is true in D2 and D3.  Unfortunately, it's completely untrue in D1.  HD's static baseline prestige system effectively limits how far a D1 power conference school can fall, and how far a non-power conference school can rise.  I would argue that it's nearly impossible to build a Gonzaga with static baseline prestige implemented.  If I won the NT at Miami (OH) the next 2 seasons, my prestige (which is currently a B) would not rise above an A-.  That is truly sad in my opinion.  To be fair, this is not a new engine issue - it's existed for some time. 

Yeah, if you aren't in a BCS conference, the A-10 plus a couple of other exceptions (Marquette/Memphis) you are capped at an A-.  These are 2 of the most successful low-mid runs I know of off the top of my head, and both were capped at A-.

Montana in Allen:

Season	Coach	Overall W-L	Home W-L	Road W-L	Neutral W-L	Conf W-L	Rank	RPI	Prestige	Notes
43	Sim AI	0-0	0-0	0-0	0-0	0-0		0	-
42	dalter	23-9	11-2	8-5	4-2	11-5	17	8	A-	NT At-large Bid NT (Elite 8)
41	dalter	25-6	11-2	11-2	3-2	14-2	13	5	A-	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (Sweet 16)
40	dalter	28-5	11-2	12-1	5-2	15-1	6	9	A-	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (Final Four)
39	dalter	29-5	13-0	9-4	7-1	15-1	3	2	A-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Final Four)
38	dalter	28-5	12-1	11-2	5-2	14-2	8	2	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (Elite 8)
37	dalter	30-3	12-1	12-1	6-1	16-0	3	3	B	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Elite 8)
36	dalter	26-5	12-1	10-3	4-1	16-0	17	20	B-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (2nd Round)
35	dalter	25-6	11-2	10-3	4-1	15-1	18	18	B-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (2nd Round)
34	dalter	22-7	11-1	10-4	1-2	13-3		35	C+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)

Manhattan in Tark:

19	johncannon	29-4	11-1	12-2	6-1	16-0	3	7	A-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Elite 8)
18	johncannon	30-4	12-1	11-2	7-1	16-0	6	7	A-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Final Four)
17	johncannon	31-3	12-0	12-2	7-1	16-0	2	5	B+	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Final Four)
16	johncannon	24-8	8-4	11-3	5-1	14-2		31	C+	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Sweet 16)
15	acn24	35-0	13-0	13-0	9-0	16-0	1	1	C	Conf Champion CT Champion National Champion
14	acn24	26-7	11-2	9-4	6-1	14-2		28	C	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Elite 8)
13	acn24	29-3	11-0	13-2	5-1	15-1	2	1	-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Sweet 16)
12	acn24	29-3	10-1	14-1	5-1	16-0	7	23	-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Sweet 16)
11	acn24	27-5	10-2	12-2	5-1	15-1	17	8	-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Sweet 16)

Been arguing with CS about this issue recently myself and they don't think there is a thing wrong with the way baseline affects the game. So untrue.

But shouldn't Kentucky's baseline result in MetsMax and others losing their jobs?     

The bottom line is that they are trying to balance having firings with their (understandable) reluctance to anger their paying customers.

I get it. This makes sense. It is really, really difficult to get fired because of it.

That said, I would like to see firings ramped up -- particularly at the elite and semi-elite schools. I really don't think anyone reasonable would have a problem getting canned at Kentucky or Arizona or UConn, etc. if they hadn't made the NT in X number of seasons.

...or in the metsmax example, having never made the NT.  Here's a disclaimer, I like metsmax.  The times I have been in a conference with him I have enjoyed it thoroughly...so this is not a knock on him.

For Kentucky to still be at a B prestige after that 13 season run is a conplete joke and makes HD look silly.  Obviously, there is an agenda at work to artifically boost schools like Kentucky to keep them close to the top.  If acn24's post is accurate, the Manhattan WON the National Championship and it's prestige remained at a C...didn't even get a boost for winning it all.  This kind of nonsense just makes a mockery of the name of the company.  HD is not what if sports.com, it's more like big schools stay big no matter what sports.com.