My name is jslotman, and I'm a poacher.  I made my first poach last night when I put $35k into a player who was considering two other schools in the cycle immediately prior to signings.  One of these schools is in my conference.  I had a friend helping me recruit while I was away prior to the signing deadline, and when I returned, I still had two scholarships available and over $40k to spend.  So I did what any poacher would do:  I dumped everything I could into a guy I thought I could sign away from Wisconsin and...Toledo (???). 

And it worked.  But why do I feel so shady? 

js, it's part of the game, buddy. It happens.

Of course, you have to be a cold-blooded SOB to do that to a conference mate.

Eh, weirdrash is a great coach, and he knows what he's doing.  I have no doubt he'll have Wiscy back on its feet regardless of my otherwise untoward recruiting activities. 

Posted by daalter on 8/30/2010 7:31:00 AM (view original):
js, it's part of the game, buddy. It happens.

Of course, you have to be a cold-blooded SOB to do that to a conference mate.

"A true friend stabs you in the front."   - Oscar Wilde

Posted by nachopuzzle on 8/30/2010 10:22:00 AM (view original):

Posted by daalter on 8/30/2010 7:31:00 AM (view original):
js, it's part of the game, buddy. It happens.

Of course, you have to be a cold-blooded SOB to do that to a conference mate.

"A true friend stabs you in the front."   - Oscar Wilde

If you are going to poach, might as well poach a conference mate. Makes you stronger, and your closest rivals weaker. 

Posted by tianyi7886 on 8/30/2010 10:28:00 AM (view original):

Posted by nachopuzzle on 8/30/2010 10:22:00 AM (view original):

Posted by daalter on 8/30/2010 7:31:00 AM (view original):
js, it's part of the game, buddy. It happens.

Of course, you have to be a cold-blooded SOB to do that to a conference mate.

"A true friend stabs you in the front."   - Oscar Wilde

If you are going to poach, might as well poach a conference mate. Makes you stronger, and your closest rivals weaker. 

I've always found that to be an interesting theory.  Some (cal_bears, for instance) disagree and help their conference mates as much as possible - that way you get SOS help and postseason cash.  But at the same time, Kansas State can have a hell of a time getting to an A- prestige when three of [Kansas, Oklahoma, Wichita State, Oklahoma State, Mizzou] are very strong.

Where do you strike a balance?

I didn't single out Wisconsin in particular, for what it's worth.  I just thought the player was someone I could sign given the circumstances. 

Anyone who doesnt poach is stupid...

You will get over it. It will much easier the next time.

Posted by jslotman on 8/30/2010 11:01:00 AM (view original):
I didn't single out Wisconsin in particular, for what it's worth.  I just thought the player was someone I could sign given the circumstances. 

since there are fewer top players around, this will become more and more common.

I twice have had 50k left, two open scholies, and no recruits really left to go after that I wanted or thought would be worth making an enemy, then what do you do, pick up two throwaway guys and bank 48k times .25 = 12k, or let the 50k go down the drain?

This last go round in tark, we had about a 5 page CC discussion, I did the same thing you did, once the first signings happened, I took what I had left and put it into a local PG who was good and who I did need, my conf mate was very upset, as I honestly try to avoid such things, and normally I can.

the other thing, when 2 are battling and the notes say 'struggling to decide' you really have no idea who is going to ultimately win, your conf mate or the other guy, I already have not gone after someone, only to discover my conf mate was overextended and lost the recruit in question.

interesting stuff - I think it is going to come up more and more

"I twice have had 50k left, two open scholies, and no recruits really left to go after that I wanted or thought would be worth making an enemy, then what do you do, pick up two throwaway guys and bank 48k times .25 = 12k, or let the 50k go down the drain?"

I've thought about doing what you describe here before, signing guys just for the carryover cash but isn't that actually counterproductive? I say this because if you don't sign anybody you lose the carryover cash which looks bad but you get two walkons who become open scholarships next season and you would get 30k to fill those 2 spots instead of the 12k you got in carry over money.

I'm in the camp that "poaching" is no big deal, in most cases it's not something malicious it's usually something like OR describes or your situation jslot, you get a couple of main targets early and lock them up only to realize you have a bunch of cash left and look around to see if there is anybody else you can get and by that point in D1 everybody worth getting will be considering somebody. You either go after that guy right away or you can wait to see if the coach or coaches going after that recruit overextend themselves with other recruits and then you make your move. It's just sound strategy, in my opinion.

Posted by tmacfan12 on 8/30/2010 11:04:00 AM (view original):
Anyone who doesnt poach is stupid...

I completely disagree. Despite being highly illegal, the spotted barn owl helps to limit rodent populations, thus increasing agrarian yields and decreasing the number of possible pathogen carriers.   

I think that confermate battles will increase in the power conferences as the supply of good players starts to dry up a little.  I think the NC State/Duke/UNC/Wake is going to have to fight more for the top NC recruits.  UCLA/Stanford/Cal/etc won't have so much talent in CA they can affford to be nice. 

There just aren't 20 Centers that are at that elite level.  There is a big step down every year at like #8 or #15 or something, so there will not be enough to go around.

This is a good thing too.

I've been poached...and I waited to poach them three seasons later.

it felt REALLY good  :)

Posted by kmasonbx on 8/30/2010 11:22:00 AM (view original):
"I twice have had 50k left, two open scholies, and no recruits really left to go after that I wanted or thought would be worth making an enemy, then what do you do, pick up two throwaway guys and bank 48k times .25 = 12k, or let the 50k go down the drain?"

I've thought about doing what you describe here before, signing guys just for the carryover cash but isn't that actually counterproductive? I say this because if you don't sign anybody you lose the carryover cash which looks bad but you get two walkons who become open scholarships next season and you would get 30k to fill those 2 spots instead of the 12k you got in carry over money.

I'm in the camp that "poaching" is no big deal, in most cases it's not something malicious it's usually something like OR describes or your situation jslot, you get a couple of main targets early and lock them up only to realize you have a bunch of cash left and look around to see if there is anybody else you can get and by that point in D1 everybody worth getting will be considering somebody. You either go after that guy right away or you can wait to see if the coach or coaches going after that recruit overextend themselves with other recruits and then you make your move. It's just sound strategy, in my opinion.

Wouldn't it possibly depend on how many slots you were going to have next year?  If the year after you were graduating five seniors with five open slots the math woudl be a bit different than if the next year you were only going to be graduating one?  I would think the best of all worlds might be to reach down and pick up a cheap division two senior transfer that woudl then graduate at the end of the year and keep both carryover AND the open slot?