Has anyone ever tried a bullpen by committee, just essentially a bullpen full of good pitchers all set to LRA or SUA; in other words no set closer? If so, does the strategy work well? I am guessing the usage of pitchers becomes all about player settings?

Many of us do. It's the only way to make sure your best pitchers are pitching in the most important situations, and maximizing their innings pitched.

When you use a set closer, even though you dictate the settings you are always pretty much saving him for the end, which means there are some situations the AI just won't bring him into. I use closers, but they're not my best RPs, they're my second or third best.

LRBs and SuBs pretty much only come in when you're trailing. They're eating up innings and hoping your offense can get you back into the game.

Does unchecking this not help?
"Use Closer in Save Situations Only"

When you do that it means the closer will come in when it's late and tied. You're still leaving it up to the AI, to a certain extent.

If it's the 8th inning, you're up by 1, two on, and the other team's best hitter is up... which is when, say, you'd bring Mariano Rivera in... the AI isn't going to him unless he's an SuA, or you're out of SuAs. That's what I mean.

Posted by ParlanceGuy on 4/10/2019 2:12:00 PM (view original):
Has anyone ever tried a bullpen by committee, just essentially a bullpen full of good pitchers all set to LRA or SUA; in other words no set closer? If so, does the strategy work well? I am guessing the usage of pitchers becomes all about player settings?

Why would anyone not do this? SUA maybe a mopup guy and be done with it.

Posted by damag on 4/10/2019 2:19:00 PM (view original):
Many of us do. It's the only way to make sure your best pitchers are pitching in the most important situations, and maximizing their innings pitched.

When you use a set closer, even though you dictate the settings you are always pretty much saving him for the end, which means there are some situations the AI just won't bring him into. I use closers, but they're not my best RPs, they're my second or third best.

LRBs and SuBs pretty much only come in when you're trailing. They're eating up innings and hoping your offense can get you back into the game.

I just came back to playing in my last season after several years away....I set up my pen this way (but with no closer at all).

One thing I was thinking for the coming season...I have a multi-inning reliever who is my pen "ace"...stamina is 40 something. Was debating trying to make him the closer, uncheck the "use in save situation only" box, and make his earliest inning like 7.

Just wondering if that would trump a SUA guy if, say...SUA is struggling in the 7th or 8th...would the closer be the guy the sim would turn to in order to try and stop the bleeding there??

Posted by bobellis75 on 4/11/2019 12:03:00 PM (view original):

Posted by damag on 4/10/2019 2:19:00 PM (view original):
Many of us do. It's the only way to make sure your best pitchers are pitching in the most important situations, and maximizing their innings pitched.

When you use a set closer, even though you dictate the settings you are always pretty much saving him for the end, which means there are some situations the AI just won't bring him into. I use closers, but they're not my best RPs, they're my second or third best.

LRBs and SuBs pretty much only come in when you're trailing. They're eating up innings and hoping your offense can get you back into the game.

I just came back to playing in my last season after several years away....I set up my pen this way (but with no closer at all).

One thing I was thinking for the coming season...I have a multi-inning reliever who is my pen "ace"...stamina is 40 something. Was debating trying to make him the closer, uncheck the "use in save situation only" box, and make his earliest inning like 7.

Just wondering if that would trump a SUA guy if, say...SUA is struggling in the 7th or 8th...would the closer be the guy the sim would turn to in order to try and stop the bleeding there??

Might happen that way but I can't say I'd guarantee it. Best way I can explain it is, WE would use a closer in real life as "bring him in when you need a stopper." The AI seems to use the designated Closer like a manager would ten or fifteen years ago, SAVE HIM FOR THE END.

If you want your best pitchers not leaving innings on the table then set them all up to the same

One thing I've noticed is I guess the sim determines your best pitcher in each role in the bullpen. and that guy will always come in first (not taking into account when you set his inning to), followed by the next, etc.

For instance, I have 3 pitchers in the SUA role. And every single time this season they've been used, it's been Pitcher A followed by Pitcher B followed by Pitcher C (if it gets to him). Literally the exact same order everytime. And on top of that, if the game is close or I'm leading and those 3 have already been used it'll bring in the exact same SUB guy everytime (think he might lead the team in saves now lol).

Don't overthink this.

Put your good relievers at SuA. Let the computer pick which one to bring in during high leverage innings.

Put your iffy relievers at SuB. They'll take lower leverage situations and will only be in high leverage situations if your SuA are tired or already used.

Use one LR - this guy should be fungible, make close to league minimum, and be used solely to mop up innings in blowouts.

Never use a closer unless you like your best reliever leaving a ton of high leverage innings on the table.

I mostly agree with everyone on this thread, I use bullpen by committee on every single team except one and I'll explain why. Never say NEVER because certain times a closer can be value-added you just have to understand the reference points you are adding to.

Player Profile: Mike Prinz is a Hall of Fame caliber setup, and it's important to understand why and what settings to use. His dur + Stam means if I set his target pitch to none and Max pitch to 25, he can throw 1.2 innings 2 out of 3 days and sometimes 3 out of 4. This is manifested in his career stats, he has a huge volume of appearances with about 1.2 IP/game. He also has an excellent W-L record with substantial saves, he could get 125 wins and 250 saves which I think may be unprecedented in real life for a true reliever (non-Smoltz). Guys are supposed to get one or the other but not both

BUT I don't just want innings for the sake of innings. IMO it's a bit cavalier to say "use him as SUA to get him a ton of high leverage innings" because that's honestly not true, there's a ton of fluff in there esp when you're winning by like 4-5 simmy isn't smart enough to leave him on the bench and save him for the next day or a smaller lead if your SuB starts blowing it.

Also Prinz is great at starting innings but not great at jams that he or others created because he's bad at strikeouts, so inherited runners score on him at a higher rate. So I do have his call bullpen at 2 or sometimes 3 to have somebody else relieve him in certain spots.

On the other hand, Player Profile: Louie Kondou is a true closer. His dur + Stam make his Max pitch count either 15 or 20. The average pitches it takes for 1.0 IP is about 18, for elite guys it's about 15.5 or 16. Since you obviously can't control it, I tend to do Max 20 which tires him out faster, I can get about 2 out of every 3 games but sometimes less.

He can not and should not be pitching more innings per appearance, this player is purely a 1.0 IP pitcher nothing more nothing less. There is no higher leverage situation than late & winning or late & tied

It is also important to understand how often closers should be saving games in general. A 3-run 1.0 IP save is successful about 94% of the time by default, a 1-run 1.0 save about 80ish%. So the value added is a higher save percentage. 384/422 is 91% which is very very high for HBD, he is basically treating every lead like a 3-run lead.

Also understand the his W-L ratio is value added. If you notice in HOF voting, closers are almost always in a negative ratio because they're not designed to win, they're only designed to blow a save and lose. But Kondou is 46-41, 41 losses in 716 appearances (5.7%!!!) where you know for a fact the game is close is ridiculously low, it's astonishing. That number doesn't even make sense.

So yes, closer can be cool but it has to be under very specific circumstances

Do you use the Bullpen by Committee for Minor League bullpens also?