I'm not a WiS conspiracy theorist. I think that, generally, the engine works pretty well.

The last week or so, however, I have noticed that my gameplans really aren't being implemented the way I think they should be, and it's led to 2 or 3 unfavorable results. So, to help me not dislike WiS so much right now, I'm going to ask for help explaining this.

http://www.whatifsports.com/hd/GameResults/BoxScore.aspx?gid=5364003

My player distro was:

Zuber, Bair, Gosnell, Chapman, Scott all at 12 (+1).

Simensky at 6 (0).

Tilson at 2 (-1).

The rest at 2 or 0 and (-2).

The "12" guys were 81% of my distro. They were all at (+1).

He went with a 2-3 (+3).

I don't generally care when I lose, but I do care when I lose and I think something got screwed up. Here's what I need help with:

with 80% of my distro at (+1), why were only 33% of my shots from 3?

And, why, despite having better a fairly significant rebounding edge, was I only able to collect 7 offensive rebounds against a 2-3 (+3) and get outrebounded by 9 overall?

Well, one thing to remember is that Distro isn't ALL shots. FOr example, if someone gets fed the ball and turns it over, that would be distribution. Someone gets free throws, thats distribution. Someone gets a foul that doesn't reward free throws, that is distribution.

As for not shooting the threes. .he WAS playing a plus three defense.

The thing I would personally find odd about the game woudl be the zero free throws.

Not to mention a +5 defense in the second half. In my opinion I think 30% of shots from 3 point land is too much. If you were actually coaching this game in real life you wouldn't be wanting them to shoot from 3 so much do to them overplaying it so much.

Gotta say though when I see 0 FTs its usually odd to me but with only 2 points in the Paint the whole first half I can understand why there wouldn't be any free throws. Its hard to get FTs unless a) your up and they intentionally foul or b) you are driving to the hoop to draw fouls, neither of which were the case.

I can't explain rebounding I don't understand that part of the game at all.

Oh I also will say I do not think there is enough fouls called in HD and that accounts for a lot of these games with no FTs.

I woudl definitely second that, SChro.

I'm not really sure why it matters that he was playing (+3). If that means my guys aren't shooting 3s, then it should have meant my guys were getting easier shots inside the zone, which means I should have been fouled, oh, I don't know, maybe once.

Or it means that it should have been easier to rebound misses, which it wasn't.

It doesn't add up to me. Either my guys should have been shooting 3s, or they should have been attacking the zone.

So, either a higher % of 3s or some fouls inside, but neither happened.

Or they were shooting mid range jump shots.

You were taking inside shots but they were so spread out they couldn't foul you?

And a_in_the has it right on the distro - its too hard given the info we get from the box scores to get anything other than a vague idea about how distro plays out.

And here's a question I've always wondered about: Let's say on a given possession where no turnover or foul occurs - a particular player has a play run for them. Does that mean they ALWAYS take the shot? I've always worked under the assumption that they had the option to take the shot.

The implication here is that if they're DT'd they have the option to pass out of the double to someone open. I figured the likelihood of doing that and the ability to do that were shown by the scouting reports where the coach makes the "slightly less hairy Teen Wolf" comment, the players off IQ, and then their passing ability.

Damnit cheez, I don't want you injecting all kinds of rationality here. This is on the forums. It's supposed to be irrational.

Anyway, let's say for a second that you guys are right about distro and right about mid-range shots, that would mean that I would have beaten the zone, right? And I should have had more opportunities for rebounds with his guards behind and my bigs not being manned up? I have to assume that if I beat the zone, that means his bigs had to step out a little to challenge, leaving my guys in better rebounding position, right? So, even with my decent advantage there, I got outrebounded in a game where I had optimal rebounding conditions?

And, I took 40 shots inside the 3-pt line, with his guards in bad defensive position, and I didn't get fouled on one shot?

I said I found the no fouls a little odd myself.


As for rebounding, in a fairly similar amount of minutes, you rebounded fairly well against him with your starters, its your bench he dominated rebounding. Not sure how to interpret that, but its a starting point in dissecting things.

My bench is better on in ath/reb than his starters and my bench is WAY WAY better than his bench.

And please don't think I'm arguing. I appreciate the help. I think good discussion with point-counterpoint is the best way to discuss these things. If that's not your style, I understand.

YOU actually outrebounded him in the second half, so lets look at the first half: Part of your problem is that you missed 18 shots in the first half and he missed only ten. Even a good offensive rebounding team is going to generally get only a small portion of their own misses as Offensive rebounding - and you tend to get even less of your threes as offensive rebounding. And you shot 14 threes in the first half. SO a good portion of his rebounding advantage in the first half was entirely opportunity based.

ANd on the bench thing, I wasn't drawing any conclusions, I was just pointing out that that was where the disparity was located.

Quote: Originally Posted By a_in_the_b on 1/27/2010YOU actually outrebounded him in the second half, so lets look at the first half: Part of your problem is that you missed 18 shots in the first half and he missed only ten. Even a good offensive rebounding team is going to generally get only a small portion of their own misses as Offensive rebounding - and you tend to get even less of your threes as offensive rebounding. And you shot 14 threes in the first half. SO a good portion of his rebounding advantage in the first half was entirely opportunity based.

Even against a 2-3 (+3) with a big rebound rating advantage? I don't necessarily agree that I would only get a small percentage of off rebounds.