Signing a "probably wont sign" draft prospect Topic

smellmyfnger
Posts: 3 (0)
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5
Prospect
Will a player be more inclined to sign if you offer him a ML contract?


Thanks in advance.
12/4/2010 11:08 AM
mhulshult
Posts: 982 (0)
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5 3 63
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He will not.  It's pretty arbitrary as to whether or not he will sign.  All you can do is offer him his demands, then sit back and wait.  He'll either come back and say that he wants to sign but has raised his demands, or he will say he's not signing.
12/4/2010 1:42 PM
kcden
Posts: 1635 (0)
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If he says he declines your initial offer and says he will not sign, you can up your offer and he may still sign.  I did this a number of seasons ago in GD Bryant and he ended up signing for 10.75 Mill and a ST invite.
Brad Beckett
12/4/2010 2:19 PM
smellmyfnger
Posts: 3 (0)
Rookie
5
Prospect
I offered his demands and got the response "Trevor is content with your offer,but is still unclear about his future.College is still an option."

I then made him a ML offer with the signing bonus still the same.

I got the same exact response.

If I raise the bonus will it help or have no bearing?

From your post Kcden it sounds as though he may.


12/4/2010 3:35 PM
kcden
Posts: 1635 (0)
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Posted by smellmyfnger on 12/4/2010 3:35:00 PM (view original):
I offered his demands and got the response "Trevor is content with your offer,but is still unclear about his future.College is still an option."

I then made him a ML offer with the signing bonus still the same.

I got the same exact response.

If I raise the bonus will it help or have no bearing?

From your post Kcden it sounds as though he may.


I hate to say it, but I think you made a mistake by changing your offer before he actually rejected or accepted.  I think you now NEED him to sign to get anything out of the pick (i.e.if he refuses you won't get a comp pick). 
My understanding is that your initial offer needs to at least meet his demands and you can not withdraw it before he actually rejects it to get a compensation pick.  By making him a 2nd offer, you withdrew the first offer. 
What I was saying is AFTER he sends you a second e-mail actually rejecting your offer, you can up your offer and still sign him even if he tells you he has decided not to sign (as opposed to telling you he wants to play for you but he wants more money).
At this point I think you should wait until he makes an actual decision on your offer, then up the bonus as high as you are comfortable with/can afford (including an ML deal, if you want) and hope he signs.
12/4/2010 4:02 PM
smellmyfnger
Posts: 3 (0)
Rookie
5
Prospect
Well,that sucks for me.
12/4/2010 5:05 PM
shobob
Posts: 3403 (0)
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Just offer him what he's asking for and wait for a response.  I think that it's what the offer is that's  on the table at the point that it is refused that counts for compensation or not.  He hasn't refused it yet, he's just thinking about it at this point.
12/4/2010 5:22 PM
yoker70
Posts: 68 (0)
Hall of Famer
2 3 245
Prospect
Posted by shobob on 12/4/2010 5:22:00 PM (view original):
Just offer him what he's asking for and wait for a response.  I think that it's what the offer is that's  on the table at the point that it is refused that counts for compensation or not.  He hasn't refused it yet, he's just thinking about it at this point.
ditto.
12/4/2010 5:24 PM
plague
Posts: 2330 (0)
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I am about 0 for 5 on signing players who are listed as probably won't sign.
12/5/2010 3:36 AM
kcden
Posts: 1635 (0)
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Posted by shobob on 12/4/2010 5:22:00 PM (view original):
Just offer him what he's asking for and wait for a response.  I think that it's what the offer is that's  on the table at the point that it is refused that counts for compensation or not.  He hasn't refused it yet, he's just thinking about it at this point.
From the FAQ:
"If you don't sign your true first round pick, second round pick, or third round pick you will be awarded with a Type D pick the following season. In order to receive the compensation pick you must offer the player his initial demands, he must refuse to sign, and you must never withdraw your offer to the draft pick at any time. If those conditions are met then you will receive a compensation pick in next seasons draft in the same slot that you picked the previous season plus one depending on any other shifting from franchises that were awarded Type D compensation picks before you. This holds true for the first and second round. For third round compensation picks you will receive a pick in a supplemental round at the end of the third round in the following seasons draft. Compensation round picks for Type A and Type B FAs DO NOT qualify for Type D compensation picks."

This is why I don't believe he will receive a compensation pick if the guy doesn't sign, since he did effectively withdraw his initial offer with his second offer... I don't have experience with this situation, so maybe I'm wrong, but that's the way I read this.
12/5/2010 2:14 PM
taz21
Posts: 470 (0)
Hall of Famer
87 1 93
Prospect

I think as long as you get flat out denied, w/ the offer an offer out there for the entire process, you'll get the compensation.

Further, no need to raise your offer, it won't make a difference.  If he rejects the intial offer and decides he doesn't want to sign, you can always offer again (unless he's one of those guys who won't even let you offer a 2nd time which I think is more likely if his agent is his mother) and play the process out again.  If he flat out rejects the 2nd offer, offer his inital demands a 3rd time, then a 4th, then a 5th.  "Probably won't sign" means the odds are very low, but given an infinite amount of time to keep offerring and waiting out his decision, I think every pick would sign (again unless he's one of the guys that after he rejects the first offer, you can't even offer a 2nd time) its just a matter of getting the odds to line up in your favor.

12/6/2010 5:15 PM
Signing a "probably wont sign" draft prospect Topic
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