Below .500 record Topic

thewizard10
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For a team to get into the NT, it appears to be accepted as "fact" that your team won't get into national tournament.

However, the issue appears to be this .500 rule appears to be unwritten in any of the games rules. It doesn't say anything about a .500 team not making the national tournament.

If RPI was such a great system, why is there a .500 rule?
11/21/2011 2:20 PM
thewizard10
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I will give an example the flaw  with the RPI and a .500 record.

If you finish with a 12-14 record going into the conference tournament.  #1-#6 is in your division. #7-#12 is in another division within the conference. And #12-22 you play in nonconference. You win 12 of those games, your RPI is most likely going to be 10 or below. Do you see how this would be a flaw?

Of course, this would never be the case, happening to get the top 22 teams on your schedule, but the RPI formula and the .500 record should make sense for all conditions.

11/21/2011 2:24 PM
toysboys
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Tell me about it.  My Iowa in Crum this season is 13-14 with an RPI of 30.  I should be in the NT.
11/21/2011 2:32 PM
Weena
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It may not be written in the WIS rules but it is written in the NCAA rules that WIS follows in this area. Also, it is based on overall record so the 12-14 record you cite could still end up over .500 depending on your success in the CT.
11/21/2011 2:35 PM
thewizard10
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I knew the rule when I made out my schedule, no excuses there. But, think it would be helpful to some of the newcomers if they added that in there.

I don't think it would matter much if I went over .500, because at that point I would've won my conference tournament. Even, if I made the conference finals, I would end up at 14-15.
11/21/2011 2:40 PM
thewizard10
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Posted by toysboys on 11/21/2011 2:32:00 PM (view original):
Tell me about it.  My Iowa in Crum this season is 13-14 with an RPI of 30.  I should be in the NT.
I feel your pain, was never a big fan of the rule myself.

I think if you have the .500 rule, then throw out the RPI and come up with another formula.
11/21/2011 2:40 PM
reinsel
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I like this rule.  It prevents the superconferences from getting 12 teams in the NT sometimes.

Solution is easy.  Win more noncon games and don't have a double digit conference losses.

No teams make the big dance with a record below .500 in their conference either in real life.  (maybe 1 time in 10 years or something)
11/21/2011 2:56 PM
thewizard10
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Honestly, I think super conferences have it tougher in this regard.

A) It's tougher to win your conference tournament.

B)You run the risk of going below .500..

C)Prestige is effected due to overall record.

D)There is an overall record component in factoring your seed for the NT.

E)You're usually battling the other teams for the better recruits.

11/21/2011 3:07 PM (edited)
alblack56
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A few years back, I had a team at 13-14, RPI 35.   I was on the 'lock' list for the NT. But, when the brackets came out, I was in the PIT instead.   WIS said there was an error in the program and that a losing team shouldn't have been on the 'lock' list nor in the NT

Actually, this was the most angry I've ever been in this game. Not that the program was in error but for CS's lame excuse. They first told me that they had no control over Collegiate Insider ('forgetting' that they programmed it).  They also said that ,in RL,  columnists often predict  a team for the NT that doesn't actually make it. 

Later, they admitted the progamming error.  This was before seble took over the game.
11/21/2011 3:09 PM (edited)
thewizard10
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Okay, let me put this discussion coming from another direction.

Is it fair for the PIT teams to compete with a team that should be in the NT based on RPI alone?
11/21/2011 3:14 PM
stinenavy
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I shed a tear every time a superconference only gets 9 teams into the NT, instead of 10 or 11.
11/21/2011 3:14 PM
reinsel
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Posted by thewizard10 on 11/21/2011 3:07:00 PM (view original):
Honestly, I think super conferences have it tougher in this regard.

A) It's tougher to win your conference tournament.

B)You run the risk of going below .500..

C)Prestige is effected due to overall record.

D)There is an overall record component in factoring your seed for the NT.

E)You're usually battling the other teams for the better recruits.

Except for superconference teams have crazy amounts of NT/PT money.

ACC in Allen has $65,000 per team this season.  So that's $80,000 for 1 opening!  That's really rough.
11/21/2011 3:19 PM
milkamania
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Really, I don't see the flaw.  If you can't win half your games, you aren't good enough for the national tournament. 
11/21/2011 3:21 PM
udm_mike
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Posted by toysboys on 11/21/2011 2:32:00 PM (view original):
Tell me about it.  My Iowa in Crum this season is 13-14 with an RPI of 30.  I should be in the NT.
I disagree.  Any team is capable of having a below .500 record against good competition.  Winning games is more impressive than losing games.
11/21/2011 3:28 PM
thewizard10
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Fair enough, if you agree with the .500 rule, then the RPI should be thrown out and another formula should be implemented.
11/21/2011 3:34 PM
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