Between these two options...

D3, Triangle/FCP:

	Player A	Player B
ATH	35	55
SPD	85	85
REB	30	10
DEF	50	50
BLK	1	20
LP	45	45
PER	75	70
BH	75	60
PASS	75	70
ST	90	90
FT	C+	B-

How significant is that 20 ATH gap between A & B? Does that 20+ ATH advantage make up for the minor gaps in cores, particular the ~15 point gap in BH?

I think in this case, defense is the part that will take the biggest hit with athleticism. I think the offense will balance each other out, but defense is where it will show an impact. If you're running a press, I definitely would want Player B. In a Zone, I would probably go with Player A. In a man to man, I'd prefer Player B, but I could live Player A.

I think at PG I could live with either one (I never do FCP) .. so I would probably play the one who will grow more. But. ATH is important in a PG too. But, I try very hard to play the highest Pass rating at PG and Player A has better Passing and BH .. I would likely play him at PG. I would have no issues playing player B at SG. And i would likely play him at SG on a choice between the two.

I'd go with Player B, 100% of the time...

Ath is important in Press... Although I'd prefer a bit more passing in a Triangle PG, I think 70 is fine for D3... Ball Handling is less important in Triangle. then other sets.

Average Shooting PER is almost completely irrelevant to me in PGs, as most of your distro in Triangle is going to high PER and LP threats. 75 or 70 just isnt cutting it, regardless.

Absolutely player B

here's why i consider A the correct answer (d3 triangle/fcp). i am more of a roles guy, but because so many ratings are so similar, let me go with the simple ratings analysis. if we are looking at a non scoring pg type here, the 20 points of bh and pass easily beats the 20 points of ath. sort of end of discussion already, right? for non scorers, i'm sort of guessing passing is just about everyone's #1, with bh at least on par with, but probably ahead of, ath? and for a mid level per scoring upperclassman pg (these guys don't really look like 0-2 distro upperclassmen to me, but i'm not super in tune with d3 ratings), the bh/per contribution to offense are way more important than the ath contribution to the offense, so the gap only gets wider. although i suppose you could use B as a 2pt scorer and claim the ft and ath to be about equal to the per/bh, which i'd concede (i prefer A offensively but the B 2pt preference is rational enough and has use cases), but if this guy is pg, the def value of ath is still swamped by the bh/pass no matter what. for an actual scoring guard, per is typically by far #1 and bh is extremely important (the 3pt scoring importance of bh offsetting the loss in bh/pass importance for TOs when comparing a 1 and 2) - absolute worst case, on par with ath it seems. i guess it feels like its A in all cases?

for a backup sg sort of deal, not really a scoring guard but not a pg either, i could see an argument for player B on an elite team, where these players are basically never going to be used for anything but defense. i could maybe consider B the better non scoring backup sg or sf on an elite team with elite scoring even with a 0 contribution from B, but i'm struggling to imagine the team considering these two players is that (i know sol is a good coach! so assuming a good team. but not an awesome one).

but more importantly, what the heck great team is going to recruit a guy who isn't a pg but isn't a scoring guard either? i think the rating analysis is more straight forward, but the roles analysis i consider more compelling. B is a mediocre guard who on a mediocre team maybe could pass for good at defense, but i doubt most folks here would call him good at defense? and nobody seems to like his scoring. his bh/pass are decidedly mediocre. so what the heck is anyone here recruiting this guy to play the 2 for? someone who is good at nothing but bad at nothing is exactly the kind of player to stay away from. it honestly seems like the answer here is simple - get A for PG or even perhaps as a combo PG/SG depending on future need - or take a walkon. maybe a foul drawing uptempo or something you go B, i don't know though, i feel like you'd need a really good reason to go B.

lastly - i'm thrown by so many comments for B - where does it come from? in what role does 20 points of ath matter more for a pressing guard than the 20 points of per/bh or bh/pass? it should be a real stretch to see getting there. for a sg, per is usually by a pretty wide margin the #1 rating, a scoring guard's per is generally by a pretty wide margin the #1 rating in this game, and bh is way up there - the pg is really high on pass and bh is way up there. yet in press, ath is the junior partner to speed - on defense, ath is at best tied with spd (IMO its lower), and on offense, its generally speed by a mile (2pt scorers perhaps aside). and yet even speed is probably not the #1 rating for any guard, even in press where it is most valuable. so i feel like something has to be off, 20 ath vs 25 per/bh/pass, is usually automatic. either folks are over valuing ath on def, or on off, or undervaluing per/bh/pass i suppose. i value ath/spd pretty darn high i think? and i know some folks value ath>def for def in press, which i disagree with, but even if you allow for a reasonable holding of ath as tied for #1 on defense (with spd), it would still be junior to speed due to speed's clear offensive advantage, which is in turn itself junior to per or pass (sg/pg's #1 rating), so i still don't see how one gets 20 ath above the 25 points of per/bh/pass? plus player A is generally ahead on the BS (20 reb > 20 blk + 1/3rd ft), at worst a tie i guess for a pure 2pt scorer? maybe folks are undervaluing the bh on the pg but it is super important for TOs, and bh on a per scoring guard is a high end core, roughly tied for #2 in press probably with speed. and if you are looking at a non scoring sg... you shouldn't be :)

I agree w/ Player A at PG (as I said) .. I still think ATH is better at the SG though. There is more than one type of scoring, Right? So. high ATH and SPD and PER can also score (PlayerB .. and he makes his free throws). I was comparing them to each other, not if either has the attributes to start for a given team. I think Player A is a better PG .. I think Player B can score more points at SG.

35 ath is just too low. And the rest isn't that much different. I'm a "role player" type of coach as well. He didn't state which guard. PG or SG. So I'd go with the better talented player. 35 Ath isn't even close to a 55 Ath player. 35 Ath players foul out of more games than they don't.

I'm on the opposite of gil, as usual. Why would anyone choose player A? This isn't even close in my opinion.

One thing I left out..... i wouldn't use either player as anything important. They would just be warn bodies on the roster. Player A would be a backup PG because his ATH will keep him from staying on the floor long. And Player B isn't really elite at anything either. But can hog up minutes and not hurt you as much

This is one of those classic cases of need. If you have a need at PG, A is a bit better, as a distributor. Neither is a great defender or scorer, but at D3 both are adequate there. A is a very good distributor as a pg, so that’s a plus skill at D3, if your team has a need there.

If you don’t have that need, B is the better player, in a generic value sense.

This is why I love these threads. Lots of good nuggets here. As usual, I tend to only post these threads about backup options when recruiting. It's likely this signing would serve as a PG. Likely wouldn't start until their senior year (when the ratings reflect the above) if they start at all. Personally I'm leaning Player A as well as a PG. Though B still tickles my curiosity. Have another backup option who looks something like this - prob not going to sign him but I've had similar players who have had a surprising amount of success at PG in D3:

	Player C
ATH	35
SPD	90
REB	20
DEF	45
BLK	10
LP	25
PER	50
BH	60
PASS	80
ST	100
FT	A-