Hi all. I have a quick question about the recent removal of AAA. I have read that teams get $1.6M to spend in free agents once the season starts to make up for no minor leaguers at their disposal. I want to know if it would just make more sense to make the salary cap for open, regular, public sim leagues $82M ? that way the manager can plan on how to spend the money to their liking rather than leaving the WW up to chance. Also, why was AAA removed ? Did a certain number of people want it gone ?

Yes, quite a few did. Their theory being AAA was a disadvantage to newbies. Admin has said this is an experiment. Who knows what the future holds.

There are 80 Million Theme leagues that have the AAA if that is what interests you.

To expand on why owners felt it was a disadvantage for newbies:

All AAA were/are based off a RL players despite being given a fictitious name. Veteran owners knew how to calculate the AAA ratings to determine Who the RL players were, and could potentially make bad faith trades with new owners who didn't know how to determine this.

Veteran owners also had a better grasp on how much help they could expect to get from AAA and could use their $80m salary in the draft center much more efficiently than a newbie who wasn't as experienced with those nuances.

I still don't know if I agree with those arguments, as I feel the benefit of AAA for new owners outweighs the disadvantages, however, I am glad they're trying new things and my anecdotal experiences May differ from how newbies actually feel.

I personally feel they should remove AAA from champs leagues and add them back for Open leagues.

Posted by chargingryno on 8/17/2021 11:14:00 AM (view original):
To expand on why owners felt it was a disadvantage for newbies:

All AAA were/are based off a RL players despite being given a fictitious name. Veteran owners knew how to calculate the AAA ratings to determine Who the RL players were, and could potentially make bad faith trades with new owners who didn't know how to determine this.

Veteran owners also had a better grasp on how much help they could expect to get from AAA and could use their $80m salary in the draft center much more efficiently than a newbie who wasn't as experienced with those nuances.

I still don't know if I agree with those arguments, as I feel the benefit of AAA for new owners outweighs the disadvantages, however, I am glad they're trying new things and my anecdotal experiences May differ from how newbies actually feel.

I personally feel they should remove AAA from champs leagues and add them back for Open leagues.

Interestingly, it seemed to be the vets here who wanted the AAA gone, not the newbies. In any respect, the $1.6 mil extra that we now get does nothing to mitigate against the loss of 1800 PAs valued at +/- $11 mil. It's laughable if anyone at WIS thinks they've "fixed" that in some way. Not to mention the $3 mil value of the 2 pitchers we used to get.

Essentially, OLs have been turned into low-cap leagues where newbies cannot really play with a roster of their all-time favorites and historical greats (as advertised).

They either need to bring back AAA in a sensical way or up the cap, imo. Or offer a second OL option that is more cap-friendly to newbies. And by cap-friendly, I just mean like $90 mil or $95 mil, so a newbie can actually field a player he's heard of before.

Posted by jmcraven74 on 8/17/2021 3:54:00 PM (view original):

Posted by chargingryno on 8/17/2021 11:14:00 AM (view original):
To expand on why owners felt it was a disadvantage for newbies:

All AAA were/are based off a RL players despite being given a fictitious name. Veteran owners knew how to calculate the AAA ratings to determine Who the RL players were, and could potentially make bad faith trades with new owners who didn't know how to determine this.

Veteran owners also had a better grasp on how much help they could expect to get from AAA and could use their $80m salary in the draft center much more efficiently than a newbie who wasn't as experienced with those nuances.

I still don't know if I agree with those arguments, as I feel the benefit of AAA for new owners outweighs the disadvantages, however, I am glad they're trying new things and my anecdotal experiences May differ from how newbies actually feel.

I personally feel they should remove AAA from champs leagues and add them back for Open leagues.

Interestingly, it seemed to be the vets here who wanted the AAA gone, not the newbies. In any respect, the $1.6 mil extra that we now get does nothing to mitigate against the loss of 1800 PAs valued at +/- $11 mil. It's laughable if anyone at WIS thinks they've "fixed" that in some way. Not to mention the $3 mil value of the 2 pitchers we used to get.

Essentially, OLs have been turned into low-cap leagues where newbies cannot really play with a roster of their all-time favorites and historical greats (as advertised).

They either need to bring back AAA in a sensical way or up the cap, imo. Or offer a second OL option that is more cap-friendly to newbies. And by cap-friendly, I just mean like $90 mil or $95 mil, so a newbie can actually field a player he's heard of before.

I don't think anyone actually asked for AAA to be removed. The removal was a surprise for everyone. Admin made the change in response to a large number of complaints from new (and old) owners over the knowledge gap that AAA created and the unbalanced advantage it gave experienced owners.

The removal of AAA has had 0 effect on the salary cap except for experienced owners who were under-drafting PA and IP to maximize the value (you know, the knowledge gap thing that new owners weren't doing because they didn't understand it, or the value of the AAA players in $$$ or PA/IP). Your complaint is proving the reasoning correct.

You also qualify for champs leagues, so if you like AAA in your OL, come play in the champs leagues with us. Otherwise your complaints just make it seem like you just miss taking advantage of new owners with your knowledge gap over them on how AAA functions (not saying that's why or how you play OL, just that that's how your argument comes across).

AAA exists in champs leagues where owners all have the experience such that the knowledge gap doesn't exist, which is why AAA wasn't removed from champs leagues. But in leagues where new owners can get taken advantage of both in drafting and in trading, AAA don't exist. While it wasn't asked for, it was a surprisingly good move by admin and has increased OL participation, champs league participation, and (anecdotally) increased OL parity. good move.

I'd also argue that a friendlier OL cap to newbies would be closer to $65-75m where they can still draft their favorite players, a few HOF players, and even an all-time great season or two, while still having it play out close to RL and expectations. They can also draft a favorite RL team and enter into an OL somewhat-competitively and not just get destroyed by streamlined OL teams. The lack of realism is the biggest complaint among new owners and that lack of realism has more to do with the higher (than RL) cap allowing teams of all HOF and all-time great seasons while they draft a team full of their favorite players from the 60s, 70s, or 80's Cubs or A's or Reds or some-such thing.

Also, you want to have fun in an actual low cap league, the $40m Exclusive Player league needs just one: https://www.whatifsports.com/forums/Posts.aspx?topicID=528717 My team will have four guys who were all-stars and my exclusive is arguably one of the greatest catchers who ever played and would have surely been a HOFer if he hadn't retired in 1891 at just 26 because he disliked living on the east coast (before moving to CA).

The removal of AAA in Open Leagues has led to more participation in Theme Leagues. Even if some of them only play the old OL style themes, they now get full rewards for playoff and WS teams rather than the partial credits in OLs

for the people who are far more experienced in this game than I am, a question about putting together a roster. Being there are no more AAA players to take roster spots. Should I spend a little more cash on my hitting bench for pinch hitting and stamina for regular players or on an extra arm in the bullpen ? Which would be better suited to fill off the WW once the season starts ? Do not know if I can ask that, so excuse my inexperience if not allowed.

Posted by simsports21 on 8/17/2021 9:40:00 PM (view original):
for the people who are far more experienced in this game than I am, a question about putting together a roster. Being there are no more AAA players to take roster spots. Should I spend a little more cash on my hitting bench for pinch hitting and stamina for regular players or on an extra arm in the bullpen ? Which would be better suited to fill off the WW once the season starts ? Do not know if I can ask that, so excuse my inexperience if not allowed.

For OL I tend to draft around 600 PA per position, often with 1 or more positions made up of platoons or multiple players. I usually draft around 1,200-1,250 IP. From there, all of my pitchers are useable. I don’t draft scrubs of any kind. For my hitters, I typical have 2-4 $200k hitters. I usually release these guys to WW immediately and use the funds they free up, plus the $1.6 m to pick up either a good PH, a solid RP, or if there’s both available, I’ll waive my worst RP and pick up both the PH and the RP from the WW.

There’s a ton of info there, but if you haven’t yet, I definitely recommend checking out contrarian23’s pinned “Advice for Newbies” post at the top of the page.

thanks for your suggestions. I appreciate the time you took to write them.

There is no way around newbies having a tough learning curb other than an all newbie league. Say 5 teams or less. But there is no way a higher CAP is tougher than a lower cap. So much more finesse is needed in a lower cap to be competitive. More realistic results, sure, easier, no.

Posted by grizzly_one on 8/19/2021 2:33:00 PM (view original):
There is no way around newbies having a tough learning curb other than an all newbie league. Say 5 teams or less. But there is no way a higher CAP is tougher than a lower cap. So much more finesse is needed in a lower cap to be competitive. More realistic results, sure, easier, no.

I think as far as what’s harder or easier can be subjective. The way that I mean it is that low caps make it easier for new owners to understand the sim and high caps make it harder for new owners to understand the sim.

There Is much more luck involved the higher the cap. Veteran owners are going to be much better at understanding that, new owners won’t understand why Babe Ruth is hitting .250 with 25 HR or why Pedro is 6-22 with a 5.30ERA. Whereas with low caps, you will get more realistic numbers and while there is always luck involved, it’s a little easier to understand

It seems there is a whole new game to learn without the AAA level. I seem to understand that AAA is sort of a buffer in case you need a player to fill in throughout the season. this way you have to draft those additional PA and IP. The rookie guide still includes the information prior to AAA being eliminated. On these message boards, are there any experienced managers currently in public, open leagues and how are you navigating around not having minor leagues ?

I typically have 2-4 teams in OL at a time and have at at least 2-3 active since the AAA change. It hasn’t impacted my drafting at all with one exception. Prior to the aaa removal I would tank 1B entirely and fill with my best 2 AAA hitters. If I got more than 2 useable hitters the I’d waive or trade one of my full time players and platoon them at their position with one of my multi-position platoon guys. And I now draft 500+ PA at catcher when before I’d draft 400 and use the AAA catcher regardless of quality to fill the PA gap.

id also only bring 1,000 quality IP and fill the other 200 required with $200k scrubs who I’d send down for my aaa players who would serve as fatigue management players.

now I essentially draft a real team and not a team optimized around using AAA to its fullest.