Have never drafted 24th before and decided to use it to draft two elite complimentary players and try to fill in the usage later.

Round 1/2: Rodman and Magic gave me an insane jump on rebounds and good assists. It was clear that this start will allow me to afford to draft lower rebound guys if they had other good qualities, and that I needed to target usage, 3s, and defense going forward.

Round 3: Kemp. I almost went with Paul George here, but I was concerned about his low eFG since whoever I drafted here was surely going to get all of their shots next to Rodman and Magic. Kemp has concerns with TOs and Fouls, but at the end of the day, he’s a great scorer, sometimes-elite defender, and he gives me even more of a rebounding edge so that I can afford a low rebounding big later to slot next to him and Rodman.

Round 4/5: back to the turn. Amare is falling and I can cover his two weaknesses (Rebounding and D) with Kemp and Rodman. Let’s do it. Now it’s clear that my usage will come from my PG and two bigs. So that means I need a low usage, high D SG who can hit 3s. Danny Green is the clear answer.

Round 6/7: I considered a five-season backup PG here (Kevin Johnson or Rajon Rondo), but ultimately wanted to shore up the two weakest spots on my roster: SG and C, which were my 4/5th rounders. Kevin Love and Amare are a nice platoon for my the low-D offensive big man spot that’s now part of my system. Kyle Anderson was probably too early, but there’s no way he’s making it back to me, and he and Danny Green ensure I always have great D at the SG spot.

Round 8/9: Okay, I NEED to get a defensive big since I have Amare and Love on my team. Kemp can’t hold down a defense for 48 minutes across 5 teams. But my big men also need to have high usage since I’m now committed to low usage guys at SG and SF. Drafting bigs with good D and high usage this late is tough, but luckily I can afford to get weak rebounders since I’m so covered elsewhere. Rasheed Wallace and Josh Smith both cover what I need. And as an added bonus, both of them have seasons where they can play SF. Wait, so does Amare…and so does Love…hmmm…can I get away with not drafting a dedicated backup for Rodman?…

Round 10/11: okay I NEED 3s, but I’m not letting Pressey fall any farther. He’s got 2-3 seasons where he’d be a good backup to Magic, and another where he fits my system’s SG slot perfectly. LaMelo is similar to Magic when it comes to rebounding, ast%, and usage, so he’s a great backup for 2 seasons, plus he’ll inject some much needed 3s on those 2 teams.

Round 12: I’m good to go, no major needs, let’s upgrade one team. I had a hard time figuring out what was worse: my worst big man minutes that are seeing play (Amare’s 4th best season + Josh Smith’s 3rd best) of my worst backup PG minutes (Pressey’s 3rd best PG season). After many stupid notecard experiments, I decided to grab Darrell Armstrong who will play backup PG for one season only, while LaMelo (2x) and Pressey (2x) cover the other 4 teams.

Magic/(Pressey or LaMelo or Armstrong)
D Green/SloMo/Pressey
Rodman/(Rasheed or J Smith or Love or Amare)
Kemp/Rasheed/J Smith
Amare/Love

I think between Green/Love/Rasheed/LaMelo/Armstrong (and sometimes Magic) that I should be decent with 3s. Rebounding should be top 5. Defense looks good as a whole. We’ll see.

1. Dwight Howard - I originally had pick 23, which was where I picked in my first Savage draft. I still have not recovered from the trauma. So I wanted to trade up. I got several offers, but Ben posted at the exact same time that he wanted to trade out, and at pick 8, I knew I'd end up with a dude I wanted to build around. So I signed a deal with the devil, made the swap, and ended up with the guy I picked in the 2nd ever Savage. I finished 7th that time... hopefully my deal with the devil does me better this time.


2. Oscar Robertson - So remember that traumatic first Savage I was talking about? Yeah, I had Oscar. When I made my proxy list, it was between Glove, Big O, Kidd, and Dame. I thought Glove was the best overall, Big O had the best individual metric I used to evaluate players, Kidd would be super easy to build around, and then Dame was sooooooo tempting with all those threes. For much of the draft, I wish I had put Dame on top of that list instead of Oscar, but doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results has always worked so well in the past...

3. Elton Brand - Another guy I used before... in fact with Oscar. Again, things went horribly then, so I'm sure they'll do better now. I actually sent a second proxy list with a different guy before Brand, but I sent it to WIS user Rob instead of Robusk. I'm glad I did, because I don't think I would have liked how things turned out with the other guy. To say I don't like Brand is an understatement, but he does have great value & is an absolute stud for three seasons. Still, I wanted Ginobili here, and well, I...


4. Jerry Lucas - So that Savage where I finished 7th with Dwight? Lucas was his front court partner. Am I stupid or just some special kind of brilliant?

5. Brent Barry - At this point, I'm feeling really bad about my draft. I need threes & dimes from a lower usage shooting guard who preferably isn't *** at defense, doesn't turn the ball over much, and can at least defend at PG for this to work. The only guy who exists that fits that bill that was left was Brent Barry, and I had zero hope he'd make it to me. He did. Everything suddenly slides into place, and now I'm cooking with gas.

6. Chris Boucher - This is where the draft starts to get really fun IMO. The world is opened up, and you can either shore up weaknesses, add to strengths, or work on making specific teams with single season individual players. With all of the minutes I drafted earlier, I really had my eyes set on a few lower minute studs: Mitchell Robinson, Robert Williams, Javale McGhee, and Boucher. Well, Javale & Mitchell went back to back before me, and I thought I could surely get Williams next round, so Boucher it was! Despite my hate for Brand, he has 3 excellent seasons and 2 seasons that are at least solid. I can take that one special season of Boucher to really help my threes situation on one squad, and use the other 2 as good rotation. Feels like I improved one squad, shored up a weakness, and made an earlier pick that I hated feel a little less bad. Really excited to get him and Robert Williams next round...

7. Brandan Wright - No Robert Williams, but he's another low minute stud, and man, are four of his seasons studly! Helps with my Brand issue, and honestly, I was drafting defensively, as I thought Rob or Earl would pick him, as they seemed to be targeting the same type of guys in these rounds.

8. Walt Bellamy - So the issue with Wright is that now, to use his best season, I'm in a usage crunch: I need a tier 3+ usage backup to Dwight for that season (as well as another). I looked at Bellamy, Yao, Ruland, and a couple of other guys, and Bellamy just ended up giving me the best value for those two seasons PLUS another solid pair of tier 4 usage seasons. Yao had the better efg% for the two tier 3 usage seasons, but Bellamy was stronger in almost every other area. Probably early for him, but this was a necessity I didn't want to **** around and lose like I have before. Really, really wanting to get more SG depth though...


9. Jason Terry - All of the potential SGs I want to back up Barry with have really low ADPS recently, some even not getting drafted. I have literally 12 on my list that I'm happy with at this point, and then there's Jason Terry staring straight at me. He doubles as someone who can back up Oscar a few seasons (again, forced to use tier 3+ usage there) if I get someone else I like better, and even so, there are at least 2 seasons I'm absolutely using here. Really low rebounding is the only major blemish for me, but I am absolutely loaded on boards elsewhere, so it won't be a big deal, right? Right??


10. Wesley Person - Most of those guys from before are still around, but now with Terry in tow, I really just want the best season or two. Person has the best season, and his second best season is pretty ******* good, but after ******* around with teams, I wish I had gone with Nick Anderson.

11. Goran Dragic - I needed 2-3 seasons to back up Oscar. I had five guys I liked here, and I liked what Dragic did to my teams better than a couple of others I had rated higher overall. I flipped back & forth between Goran & Tyreke for about an hour before I pulled the trigger on the proxy. I've said it before, and I'll say it again I'm sure, but picking proxies is agonizing to me.

12. Zelmo Beaty - I really wanted Marvin Williams or Clarence Weatherspoon to shore up one more SF position. Both were gone. Zelmo has two excellent seasons, including one of the best 2 or 3 left in the sim at this point by my metrics, so it just seemed like a no-brainer to throw him in. He might not get much play (Lucas is just that ******* good), but I didn't really see anybody left in any of the other positions that helped me. At worst, he's another big I can use to manipulate fatigue. Also...


Conclusion - Honestly, despite the bullshit I strung together here, I feel really, really good about this squad. I am still shorter than I care to be on threes, but my efg, defense, rebounding, assists, fouls, and overall $/min values are above (or considerably above in a couple of circumstances) last season's squad, and turnovers aren't much worse despite starting with Dwight & Oscar. Looking at the names, it doesn't look that sexy, but... but I'm really strong.

Going to finish my teams on Monday. Still unsure of a few of my later picks, and Beal, but feeling good overall about the finished product.

Manu / Beal
James Johnson / Delon Wright / OG
Barkley / Horford / Reggie Miller
Capela / Gafford
Tree / Poeltl

Some standard tweaking of positions and starters based on seasons, Horford will play some 4, but not really too hard to put together. I think we'll be a little high on fouls... But the shooting is gonna be real good and we won't turn it over too much. Passing is pretty decent, better than my last season - Horford and Barkley help a lot. Short on defensive studs, but a lot of switchable, decent defenders to help Barkley out.

It's basically 4 usage points from PG and SF, at least 1 from SG, and from there it's just balancing out the overall usage.

13. jhsukow - David Robinson, Hassan Whiteside, Horace Grant, Jerry West, Willis Reed, Otto Porter, Kyle Korver, Victor Oladipo, Jarred Vanderbilt, Nate McMillan, Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, Kris Humphries

Round 1: Getting Admiral as late as possible seems like a good strategy. My metric my not be up to date or not sound, but I think most would agree.

Round 2: Maybe a but aggressive, but we have time to correct if needed.

Round 3-5: Good clean living. The savage equivalent of flossing twice a day and drinking enough water.

Round 6: not sure how much Porter will play. One that number is set this might be a regret. We will see.

Round 7: think I’m only going to play him 4 seasons. We will see. Need to space the floor and his ast numbers are better than I remembered.

Round 8: This was a good pick.

Round 9: Pretty aggressive, but will make two teams competitive on the glass.

Round 10: What is happening? How many teams are going sub 50 AST%? How are teams going defend PGs? Happy with this pick too.

Round 11-12: Shai might get more run than I expected. Humphries will play that whole 30 dreb season and might play some SF.

Overall, feeling pretty good but will need a lot of division luck as I have been the worst in this format to play all 9 seasons.

Posted by dh555 on 10/19/2022 3:20:00 PM (view original):
damn you jcred...i was starting to think biedrins would make it back to me...really wanted to pull the trigger on him in the 10th

tried to learn from my Zubac mistake

What do you have planned for us defending champ? Some prior bars have been set pretty high....

1) Kevin Garnett - I briefly wanted to trade up for D Rob, but once he went, I was good staying put for Garnett. I have never really used Garnett and I like 5 seasons of his, so I was happy with this pick.

2) Ben Wallace - I really wanted Dr. J with this pick. Once Moses started dropping, I really had to consider him because I thought his oReb would be a good pair with Garnett. Ultimately going into my pick I wanted Dr. J, Moses, and then Wade. Somehow I talked myself into Wallace at the last second. My gut tells me Wade was the pick.

3) Walt Frazier - I figured Ben would take Holiday and I wanted him in this spot. As the turn approached, I kept trying to rank PG, Bobby Jones, and Walt Frazier. At one point I had Bobby Jones ranked #1, but I was only going to be able to use his SF/PF rotation on one of my team with Garnett, so I pivoted to Frazier. I have never used Frazier and I think he is a solid choice at this spot, but you need the right SG.

4) Christian Wood - Somehow by this point I have talked myself into having a Christian Wood/Luka SG rotation. I was already building on it. I didnt think Wood would make it back to me after the turn, so I took Wood here. I am still not sure how I feel about this pick and I wonder how my teams would look with the 3 Luka seasons rather than Wood.

5) Zach LaVine - Luka got taken right after Wood, so I was WIS devastated. I actually had my mind set on Lavine with the way the board played out, but this is the one pick I do not like and I am still not sure why I was sold on Lavine. I wanted 3 seasons of a player who shot primary from the outside and I guess that is what sold it for me. A somewhat wise old man asked me about Brent Barry in this spot and I really think that was the right pick. I just got nervous about usage and selected Lavine. Gulp.

6) Anthony Mason - I proxied Kermit in this spot and I had all intentions of taking Kermit Washington. I needed some offensive boards while Garnett was at the 3 and Kermit could fill that spot and start one season at the 3. I pivoted to Mason due to his flexibility at the 3, for more seasons than Washington. I feel like this was another miss and my 2nd biggest regret after Lavine.

7) Chris Webber - I am happy with this pick and this is who I was targeting to be Garnett's backup the whole draft.

8) Dejounte Murray - Originally I had planned on playing Wood at SG for 2 seasons. The problem is, I couldnt find the right SF pairing for one of his seasons and he couldnt switch with a PG on D, so I had to move Wood to SF and find a SG a liked. I took Murray for the boards and his position flexibility. I also couldnt find another SG, outside of Ron Harper, that I liked in this spot, but I liked the boards and assists more than what Harper's defense offered. I probably could have pivoted to another position on this pick, but I still dont know who I would have taken.

9) Russell Westbook - At this point I have 4 players playing guard in some combination, but I didnt have a single backup at PG and was worried about assists off the bench and what happened to my boards when Wood and Murray were on the bench for two teams. This seemed like a good spot for all that Westbook offers and while I havent built out my benches yet, I hope he is going to add something off the bench.I did debate Terrell Brandon a lot before I made this pick.

10) George T Johnson - I was hoping Terrell Brandon would make it back to me at that spot, but that dream died shortly. After Brandon was taken, I felt George was the clear pick for me. I assumed he would back up Big Ben for all 5 seasons, while giving me solid defense and boards.

11) AC Green - I had Green ranked right behind George on my wish list. I liked the main Green season as a starter worthy SF season and I needed some depth on other SF teams.

12) Larry Sanders - After I took Green, I had talked myself into my current squad and told myself I just wanted Marvin Williams with my last pick. I was already using 4 different players at SF, but what is one more. Once Marvin was drafted, I had Larry as my first choice. He will be a solid backup for two teams.


Good Move: Drafting Garnett and Frazier. I think these were the right two picks out of all 12 of my selections. I do really like my last 4 selections and I feel like they were good value, but there are things I am missing.

Tell Me Why: Where are the 3s and the efficiency? Arent both of these things staples for winning teams in WIS? What was I thinking? Too much focus on boards and defense

Could Surprise: I really may be surprised by how many minutes I get out of Mason, Green, Lavine, and Westbrook. This surprise could end up being nightmarish.

billups / robertson / green

Wait do I have to do some kind of eval thing? Damn I didn’t realize that. It’s gonna take me at least a couple days, guys; the timing with work stuff isn’t great.

Posted by tarheel1991 on 10/23/2022 1:04:00 PM (view original):
Wait do I have to do some kind of eval thing? Damn I didn’t realize that. It’s gonna take me at least a couple days, guys; the timing with work stuff isn’t great.

You could do what Pex did and wait till 3/4 of the season is done and only do like 6 teams lol

I want to see a public service announcement that shows a soaking wet albiband0 telling the viewer “never draft and drive” while they are pulling his car out of Lake Geneva in the background.

Posted by ashamael on 10/23/2022 6:14:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tarheel1991 on 10/23/2022 1:04:00 PM (view original):
Wait do I have to do some kind of eval thing? Damn I didn’t realize that. It’s gonna take me at least a couple days, guys; the timing with work stuff isn’t great.

You could do what Pex did and wait till 3/4 of the season is done and only do like 6 teams lol

Oooh tempting!

Posted by tarheel1991 on 10/23/2022 1:04:00 PM (view original):
Wait do I have to do some kind of eval thing? Damn I didn’t realize that. It’s gonna take me at least a couple days, guys; the timing with work stuff isn’t great.

I mean, you don't have to do a podcast like Ben did.... but a little something. Send me a free team and I'll ghost write it for you.

Here's my own draft analysis/story:

1. Disappointed to be in the 21 spot. Thought about trading up and was tempted by rob's offer at 7, he ended up with a really cool 1-2 combo I'd have liked. But I think I was worried I couldn't build they way I want around Shaq. I probably would have gone Howard for an easier/more flexible build. Anyways I was hoping AD or Garnet would slide to me so thanks 24 and ed for taking those guys. 3rd time I've had Bird - the good; good not great higher usage with pretty efficient scoring, great assists that allows you to go pretty low at the 2. The bad - SF is super deep and now you're chasing a defending big and guards.
2. Happy to get Doc here. Obviously the D and boards, covers Bird when needed. Gets enough assists. SG falls off pretty quick so happy with that.
3. Very happy to get Dikembe here (I hope). First time using, long time admirer. Think he benefited from the recent defensive adjustments with pretty much every season 100. Now have most seasons with 2 100 guys around Bird who do their job. Dikembe usually gets enough boards, especially with Bird and Doc and he's a little sloppy - but he's low usage so the TO's hopefully won't kill me.
4. With 5 full time seasons across 3 positions I wanted to pivot to value. I don't love Hardaway, great ODL guy but his seasons get warts pretty quick. One great season, a second ok with kinda high TO and meh D. Only starting him twice. Had my eye on John Collins - thanks Chewy.
5. With all the D I grabbed Vucevic who I think fits fine next to Dikembe. Bad D, but real good rebounds, super clean player, some passing and 3's and will both start and provide bench usage. Solid value pick
6. Not a big Harper fan, he doesn't do much except play solid D and not hurt you anywhere except his fear of crashing the boards. Hardaway needed help for sure. Didn't really have any other options and I'm not as comfortable as some other notably successful owners at pushing the assist floor.
7. Robert Williams has a couple great back up seasons and will probably start next to Dikembe once. I wish he'd stay healthy on the Celts.
8. I think this is about the time my attention started slipping. I don't mind wait times on the draft, but this one I noticed my pick prep slipping. Had Zubac teed up and for some reason thought it was more important to get a Bird back up. I got Biedrins later, wish I could have a do over herer. David West is all over the place - a great Bird backup season with 100 D. Also passes well, solid usage and has both very low and very high TO seasons.
9. I picked Mo Bamba here. He'll play some minutes. Not much to add.
10. Biedrins is pretty good value here
11. Like Ingram here. Here's a great back up, first 3 game losing streak I'll probably be tempted to play him more at PG and slide Doc to SF.
12. Bogdan is needed a couple times to cover for Ingram

That's all. Final analysis - I would guess my team will be about as good as last season. I think top 10 but not sure top 5. My models have it being a very good defensive team with I think more scoring than last years' team - but it may have a bit more TO's.

The last few seasons I usually go through one build of teams, it goes pretty quick. This season I did three and was disappointed in all of them.
The good (%s are current season divided by last season):
efg: 0.8% improvement
3pm: 11.6% improvement
oreb: 8.6% improvement
dreb: 2.1% improvement
ast: 4.6% improvement

The bad:
to: 9.3% worse
stl: 17% worse
blk: 14.2% worse
def: 9.1% worse
fouls: 4.1% worse

My general take is that the bad stuff is outweighing the good stuff by too much and I will be lucky to be in the top 12. I see *maybe* two playoff teams if I am lucky. Lots of missteps but mostly I think I just got unlucky with players dropping to me... a side effect of being sandwiched between a bunch of good owners at my slot. I constantly ended up reaching for guys a round early.