Posted by tangplay on 9/13/2021 9:56:00 PM (view original):

Posted by strikeout26 on 9/13/2021 9:37:00 PM (view original):
It doesn't impact black people disproportionately. It impacts certain areas disproportionately. It's more geographical than it is race based. The county that I lived in in GA was 92% white and had the highest poverty rate in GA. Forbes also listed it as the poorest town in GA. The same can be said about Appalachia. It's predominantly white and poor.

Now if you're asking why black people tend to be poorer, that's has a lot to do with generational wealth. What to do about that is not clear. Throwing money at the problem has proved ineffective. We have spent $20T on the war on poverty and it has not shown results.

Yeah, black people tend to be poorer today mostly because of generational wealth, and they have less generational wealth because of racism, which was my point.

We've litigated the solutions stuff before and we just disagree. Obviously just giving people money doesn't solve all of these problems, however I would contend that solutions require significant financial investment. We've agreed on some things and disagreed on others.

Is $20T not a “significant financial investment”?

Spending money doesn't mean you're spending money wisely.

Here’s the problem with that. Virtually everything that the government does goes poorly. I’m not sure a single thing has went well under the Biden admin yet. Most of the problems in America throughout its history were caused by government policy. Why would you trust them with trillions more to screw up?

I disagree that the government has always failed to solve problems or reduce harm. I also disagree with your take on the Biden admin.

I'd just like to point out that libertarian governance repeatedly fails (such as in Kansas), whereas my preferred form of economic policy has the greatest track record on earth today imo (look up countries by economic mobility; there's a lot of "big government spending" countries at the top of that list).

Posted by strikeout26 on 9/14/2021 12:17:00 AM (view original):
Here’s the problem with that. Virtually everything that the government does goes poorly. I’m not sure a single thing has went well under the Biden admin yet. Most of the problems in America throughout its history were caused by government policy. Why would you trust them with trillions more to screw up?

are we not out of afghanistan

i believe we are out

me, you, and the army of the potomac



obamacare

so terrible twenny years later

its like the devil took over doctordom



welfare, social security, so much socialism

turrible turrible



now we gotta take from the 1% and cut em down to the 5%

MAGA

The Supreme Court case I mentioned was actually in 1905. Jacobson v Massachusetts which decided that states could mandate vaccines.
Liberty was declared not absolute and the states had the power to regulate in times of serious health condition affecting the general population.
Compulsory vaccine mandates were specifically upheld as within the proper and legitimate power of the state.

This case has been cited countless times in cases involving states and cities and school districts.
It will surely be used to defeat DeSantis if his attempts to crush mask and or vaccine mandates in cities and school districts reaches the Court.

There have been no federal mandates before the Court but I do not think any prominent legal authority thinks that this Court would differentiate the federal government from states and cities and school districts for the type of mandates Biden set forth.

The entire Court has been loathe to give any support to stopping Covid restriction except for religious exemption.

Also in the workplace OSHA has regulatory power in the workplace and its power is entrenched in the law.
OSHA can insist on masking and or vaccines in large workforce’s in the circumstances outlined by Biden.

When I said John Marshall it was not the original.
It was John Marshall Harlen.
The case was in 1905 and was a 7-2 decision.

So Strikeout was correct that there has been no Supreme case directly addressing Federal mandates
but the vast legal consensus ( minus out of the woodwork political agenda thinkers ) believe that Biden’s mandates would not get any deflection or diversion from a Supreme Court and almost definitely not this one.

Mwett I hope I have not offended you or caused you to rise in anger because of these posts.
If so I am truly sorry.
If the way that I write is offensive I guess I’m sorry.
If my writing smacks of elitism I’m sorry for the perception. It does not come from that place.

I just give an opinion on what I think are the worthy subjects.

The way I walk is just the way I walk
The way I talk is just the way I talk
The way I write is just the way I write

- Jack Scott - with unlicensed liberty

First, Jacobson clearly only applies to states.

As far as OSHA, a lot of legal scholars on both the left and right believe that a vaccine mandate is outside of their scope. OSHA doesn’t even know how they can enforce it. It’s something the Biden Admin threw on them. Even if it is found to be constitutional, it will be unenforceable. OSHA doesn’t have the man-power to enforce it.

It will also destroy mid-size businesses. The cost alone from testing the unvaccinated every week will completely decimate profit margins.

Looks like a ton of unvaccinated people might be looking for new employment.

Nah, it will rightfully get struck down.

This authoritarian rule is going to prove much more dangerous long-term than Covid. History has shown us that. I'm not sure it's in your best interest to be rooting for an elected dictator.

Posted by strikeout26 on 9/14/2021 10:37:00 AM (view original):
First, Jacobson clearly only applies to states.

As far as OSHA, a lot of legal scholars on both the left and right believe that a vaccine mandate is outside of their scope. OSHA doesn’t even know how they can enforce it. It’s something the Biden Admin threw on them. Even if it is found to be constitutional, it will be unenforceable. OSHA doesn’t have the man-power to enforce it.

It will also destroy mid-size businesses. The cost alone from testing the unvaccinated every week will completely decimate profit margins.

Yes - you were right that Jacobson applied to states because the case was dealing with Massachusetts.
I agree that you were correct.
But since then the United States Supreme Court has applied Jacobson to cities and school districts.
I do agree that there has not been a Federal case yet but based upon all the other Supreme Court cases one could expect them to use the exact same reasoning based on the precedent.
They never said that Jacobson applied only to states
and they have applied it to non states - cities and school districts.

On OSHA we have a carved out issue and time will tell. What is good and admirable is that astute people understand that OSHA authority will come before the Court and it is exciting to follow the developments.

I sincerely appreciate being able to have an intelligent and mature conversation with you with no name calling or rancor or snarky attitude.
That is the way it is supposed to be and I’m sure that will continue.
That is all I want. If it is the opposite from others I will turn off the channel.