the perfect gameplan - Page 2 - Hoops Dynasty

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#1 - in any specific game, do you feel one of those 11 settings gives you a better chance of winning than the other 10?

a - yes

My answer is yes with the knowledge that any of the myriad of things that can happen during a game can affect any given outcome. I do not think that DEF is as important in the game engine as it should be.

#2 - do you think game to game the best setting changes?

a - yes I gameplan

Within certain parameters, I will game plan, but primarily for DEF setting. Things like distro, depth chart, and 3 pt. shooting may vary only slightly from game to game.

#3 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, over the worst setting?

The terms best and worst are based on both subjective viewpoint and some individuals interpretation of numbers. Consequently, I am reluctant to make a definitive statement that describes what might be the 'best and worst'. Yet, I feel that one should pick a DEF positioning as it is determined by the individual coach's perceptions. My feeling is that the differences in the score can be as little as one point, or as many as 30 by being as little as one spot off on DEF.

#4 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, vs the next closest setting (i.e. -1 to zero)?

As I mentioned in #3, this can vary from one point to 30. How many times have we seen two teams play each other twice in a season, both use the same DEF settings, and there by wide differences in the outcomes of the games. This and many other things make DEF positioning problematic, at best. I don't want to put words in his mouth, but this may be the reason why OR made this post. My feeling is that DEF should make a difference in a simulation like this, but frequently, it doesn't seem to matter and games come down to an HD version of Friday night poker and gamesmanship.

#5 - with the upcoming engine change, how much do you think your answers are going to change?

I am not going to make any predictions on what the new engine will look like. Without doubt, there will be some things I see quirky in the engine fixed, some not, and other problems created. It would be difficult to imagine that any product is going to satisfy everyone, and certainly not anyone in entirety.

#6 - do you wish settings had more or less affect on winning

a - more

DEF should make a difference, and if the game continues to be gamesmanship and an erratic case of crap shoot, then take it out of the game in entirety.

11/30/2009 6:58 PM

isack24

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Quote: Originally Posted By coach_billyg on 11/30/2009
you none's on number 5 have obviously never worked in software development :) i mean that in a nice way, its nice you have faith in seble et all but none is a bit unrealistic. if he does a great job, i mean really fantastic, there will still be problems, at the least, changes, that we are not told about that were not intentional. at the very, very least.

I don't think you read the question properly.

EDIT: Or I didn't. I read it as, "assuming the update works as intended, will your answers to the previous questions change." Maybe I'm wrong.

11/30/2009 7:01 PM

blaank182

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I have turned into the old coach who is lost for words when looking at the games. I'm not sure what I am doing is making a difference and furthermore I doubt that it ever did. We've waited so long for these supposed changes to get here but honestly I've just been paying for seasons to "hold my spot" at my end of the line jobs. I just don't see the point anymore. I let a great job go in Wooden out of frustration over results and early entries. I'm down to 3 seasons and unless this new engine rollout is the second coming, on-par with getting a Sega Genesis when I was a kid, then I'm afraid I'm done.

#1 - in any specific game, do you feel one of those 11 settings gives you a better chance of winning than the other 10?

c - no, but I think several of them give me the same odds of winning, the others less so

#2 - do you think game to game the best setting changes?

a - yes I gameplan

#3 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, over the worst setting?

c - 3 to 5

#4 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, vs the next closest setting (i.e. -1 to zero)?

b - 1 to 3

#5 - with the upcoming engine change, how much do you think your answers are going to change?

c - lots

#6 - do you wish settings had more or less affect on winning

a - more

12/1/2009 1:37 AM

oldresorter

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a ? for all you guys who want settings to be more important, what happens when someone cracks the code and wins all the time, this has happenned in the past, and cs has rushed in and taken the strategy away -

I have at times rattled off a pretty long list of these, the one I will say that oldtimers would have to agree with is wearing the opponent out with pace, target vs fatigue planning, superior stamina, pressing, etc - I would guess that whole series of strategies indeed was worth 6-12 points every game - this was pretty commonly used by all the top coaches

another one that far fewer knew about was using DT'ing in a non conventional way - at one point, I led the nation in rebounding differential at EACH of my programs (don't worry 3-4 years ago, when plumpy was the guru of this game)

12/1/2009 5:21 AM

oldresorter

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another ?, if random number theory is the most important reason this game works (a statement I believe to be true) - are you guys suggesting that having strategy and settings work more strongly is more important than getting sims that mirror college basketball?

for any of you who have played competitive products on playstation or whatever, that is what I found lacking in them and what I enjoy most about this game

12/1/2009 5:27 AM

daalter

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Quote: Originally Posted By oldresorter on 11/30/2009

#1 - in any specific game, do you feel one of those 11 settings gives you a better chance of winning than the other 10?

a - yes

#2 - do you think game to game the best setting changes?

a - yes I gameplan

#3 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, over the worst setting?

d - 5 to 7

e - 7 or more

#4 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, vs the next closest setting (i.e. -1 to zero)?

b -1 to 3

#5 - with the upcoming engine change, how much do you think your answers are going to change?

b - little

#6 - do you wish settings had more or less affect on winning

a - more

12/1/2009 8:01 AM

spoon4

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#1 - in any specific game, do you feel one of those 11 settings gives you a better chance of winning than the other 10?

a - yes, playing dow low for rebounding versus outside for perimeter control matters against the right teams

#2 - do you think game to game the best setting changes?

a - yes I gameplan for the above reasons

#3 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, over the worst setting?

d - 5 to 7

#4 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, vs the next closest setting (i.e. -1 to zero)?

d - 5-7

#5 - with the upcoming engine change, how much do you think your answers are going to change?

b - little

#6 - do you wish settings had more or less affect on winning

a - more

Extra Queston 1 - Code cracking??? Gawd I hope not, that's not the challenge, is it?

Extra Question 2 - The randomness is great, have an unranked team beat the #2 once in awhile, however having the talent to be #2 is merit to be in the Championship Game.

12/1/2009 10:05 PM

coach_billyg

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Quote: Originally posted by spoon4 on 12/01/2009#1 - in any specific game, do you feel one of those 11 settings gives you a better chance of winning than the other 10?a - yes, playing dow low for rebounding versus outside for perimeter control matters against the right teams#2 - do you think game to game the best setting changes?a - yes I gameplan for the above reasons#3 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, over the worst setting?d - 5 to 7#4 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, vs the next closest setting (i.e. -1 to zero)?d - 5-7#5 - with the upcoming engine change, how much do you think your answers are going to change?b - little#6 - do you wish settings had more or less affect on winninga - moreExtra Queston 1 - Code cracking??? Gawd I hope not, that's not the challenge, is it?Extra Question 2 - The randomness is great, have an unranked team beat the #2 once in awhile, however having the talent to be #2 is merit to be in the Championship Game.

on your first extra question... code cracking is just trying stuff until you find something that works abnormally well, and using it. at some level, that is what we are all doing, just the extent of "working abnormally well" varies. if there are "broken" strategies, they will be exploited, just like every other strategy game. so whether that's the challenge or not, hoping its not sure ain't gonna stop it from happening :)

12/1/2009 10:25 PM

jfinn19

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#1 - in any specific game, do you feel one of those 11 settings gives you a better chance of winning than the other 10?

c - no, but I think several of them give me the same odds of winning, the others less so

#2 - do you think game to game the best setting changes?

a - yes I gameplan

#3 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, over the worst setting?

d - 5 to 7

#4 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, vs the next closest setting (i.e. -1 to zero)?

c - 3 to 5

#5 - with the upcoming engine change, how much do you think your answers are going to change?

a - none

#6 - do you wish settings had more or less affect on winning

a - more

I tend to gameplan for every game, but I am starting to believe that it does not matter as much as I have previously thought. I feel like sometimes the engine just wants you to lose and you lose even though you had a perfect gameplan while the other teams gameplan is subpar.

12/1/2009 10:38 PM

nbstowman

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1. C some more than others.

2. A almost always gameplan...When I'm a 50+ point favorite I generally don't bother. Plus things like distro and pace mean more than def setting imo.

3. E. I think it can be huge.

4. C. More than one basket, but not a huge difference.

5. B. Little

6. C. In general I think it's done pretty well.

12/1/2009 10:41 PM

coach_billyg

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this is a really interesting survey OR, thanks, and thanks to everybody for answering. its great to see what some other guys think on the subject :)

12/1/2009 10:42 PM

acn24

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Quote: Originally Posted By oldresorter on 11/30/2009
#1 - in any specific game, do you feel one of those 11 settings gives you a better chance of winning than the other 10?

c - no, but I think several of them give me the same odds of winning, the others less so

#2 - do you think game to game the best setting changes?

c - combination of the two. Usually tweak a little here and there early in the season, generally set and run through conf. play, start planning again for postseason.

#3 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, over the worst setting?

d - 5 to 7

#4 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, vs the next closest setting (i.e. -1 to zero)?

b - 1 to 3

#5 - with the upcoming engine change, how much do you think your answers are going to change?

b - little

#6 - do you wish settings had more or less affect on winning

a - more

I'm generally of the camp that it is a lot harder to win a game with a great gameplan than it is to lose a game with a bad gameplan.

12/2/2009 9:14 AM

jetwildcat

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Quote: Originally posted by oldresorter on 12/01/2009another ?, if random number theory is the most important reason this game works (a statement I believe to be true) - are you guys suggesting that having strategy and settings work more strongly is more important than getting sims that mirror college basketball?for any of you who have played competitive products on playstation or whatever, that is what I found lacking in them and what I enjoy most about this game

i feel like if the engine simulates real basketball well, the implication of meaningful strategy will follow must more easily. i would like to see a sim engine realistic enough that when somebody introduces a quirky-but-effective strategy (like running only -5 or something of the sort), people treat the strategy as clever and/or revolutionary, rather than cheap. for example, i'd like to see someone treat a whatif strategy like people treated calipari's dribble-drive offense when it came out--not cheap, but smart

12/2/2009 9:26 AM

spoon4

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I do believe that gameplanning is 4th among player statistics, rank, and the anomaly of the engine, sometimes you just know there's going to be an upset, or win.

12/2/2009 9:51 PM

muredskin00

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#1 - in any specific game, do you feel one of those 11 settings gives you a better chance of winning than the other 10?

c - no, but I think several of them give me the same odds of winning, the others less so

I don't believe there's a significant difference between, say, a -1 and a -2 so I don't sweat those decisions. On the other hand, I do think there's a big difference between a -1 and a -3 or -4.

#2 - do you think game to game the best setting changes?

a - yes I gameplan

Within the parameters discussed above.

#3 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, over the worst setting?

e - 7 or more

#4 - how many points of differential do you think the ideal setting is worth, vs the next closest setting (i.e. -1 to zero)?

a - 0 to 1

Honestly, I think any effect here could be explained by the RNG.

#5 - with the upcoming engine change, how much do you think your answers are going to change?

b - little

Little, I think. Lots, I hope.

#6 - do you wish settings had more or less affect on winning

a - more

Utlimately, I'm not sure I want the decision between a 0 and a -1 to decide a ton of games, but it would be nice to think that the decision between, say, a 0 and a -1 and a -3 to mean more than I think it currently does.

12/3/2009 7:01 AM

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