10 teams in the NT from 1 conference!!! Topic

oldave
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but gil, the top d3 teams have majorbuilt in advantages as well.... no?

and, i dont want to do this becuas it allways ****** me off when i was on the d3 side of the argument, but in d3 alot of your "competition" is very new to the game and at a big experience disadvantage. just sayin.
6/13/2010 12:03 AM
dalter
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The competition and level of coaches in DI is just much, much higher than DIII. As is the competition for recruits. It's just not comparable.

So yes, BCS teams have certain advantages. But teams are also cannibalizing each other during recruiting, and you're not in a division filled with loads of sims and less experienced coaches. (That's not to say that all DIII coaches are weaker/less experienced of course, but on the whole I think it's a very fair statement.)

oldave, to response to your last comment, DIII teams don't have built-in advantages, they have advantages that they've earned, and that's the difference. That said, I don't think it's much of an argument that doing it at DIII is easier.
6/13/2010 12:48 AM
vandydave
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easier in d1
6/13/2010 1:11 AM
dalter
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Sky is blue.

Your turn.
6/13/2010 1:13 AM
oldave
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yeah, daalty, i misspoke when i said the topd3 teams had "built in"advantages. you are correct, coaches do earn those advantages. still, once they gain that high prestige at d3 or d2, it is not that hard to keep it.

but , for the most part daalty and i agree... which should be proof enough that either i am correct, or the apocolypse is drawing nigh.
6/13/2010 1:15 AM
daveymac
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d1, especially bsc is so much harder it isn't even funny. On off days you are playing HOF coaches. You see teams all the time with 790 or so tpr that end up in the PIT cause the lose 8 or 9 conference games.

6/13/2010 1:20 AM
aejones
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meh, i don't have d1 exp but i feel like i could almost definitely come into the 12th best team in a d2 conference and have them be in the top 2 or 3 ~5 seasons in or so.
6/13/2010 2:09 AM
dcy0827
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Quote: Originally Posted By tkimble on 6/12/2010I only know d3, but it seems like it would be easier at high level d1 because of the baseline presitges. Even with a couple down seasons, a high baseline prestige keeps you up at a high prestige making it easier to get good recruits. With a couple down seasons at d3, you're back to a B-/C+ prestige and you can't get the pulldowns/dropdowns you used to be able to. Personally, I'd say it'd be hardest to do it at d2, where you'd need to get 9 of the 23 at large bids.

Not trying to nitpick here, but there are actually 41 at-large bids in D2, not 23.
6/13/2010 8:19 AM
hitman1979
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Quote: Originally posted by aejones on 6/13/2010meh, i don't have d1 exp but i feel like i could almost definitely come into the 12th best team in a d2 conference and have them be in the top 2 or 3 ~5 seasons in or so.

Maybe. Really depends on who those other 11 coaches are, and how established they are. When some of those mid-range teams are poor or Sim-coached, it's easy to improve. When you can't get more than four or five conference wins a season, it gets VERY difficult to improve your prestige. Give it a shot and let us know how you do.
6/13/2010 12:20 PM
tkimble
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Quote: Originally posted by dcy0827 on 6/13/2010
Quote: Originally Posted By tkimble on 6/12/2010I only know d3, but it seems like it would be easier at high level d1 because of the baseline presitges. Even with a couple down seasons, a high baseline prestige keeps you up at a high prestige making it easier to get good recruits. With a couple down seasons at d3, you're back to a B-/C+ prestige and you can't get the pulldowns/dropdowns you used to be able to. Personally, I'd say it'd be hardest to do it at d2, where you'd need to get 9 of the 23 at large bids.Not trying to nitpick here, but there are actually 41 at-large bids in D2, not 23.


Woah, my bad. There's only 23 automatic bids and 41 at large. Guess I shouldn't post late at night.
6/13/2010 1:14 PM
coach_billyg
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6/13/2010 1:29 PM
moy23
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Quote: Originally posted by coach_billyg on 6/12/2010
Quote: Originally posted by oldave on 6/12/2010bullcrap , Al!!!!it is HARDER in D1 for a whole slew of reasons:
  • more good coaches competing for roughly 50 spots (lets say 14 go to weakish CT winners)
  • EE -  this is HUGE.  EE just decimates good  and great D1 teams with regularity.  To have 10 teams succesfully avoid/ deal-with EE and get into the NT is incredible
  • because of the increase cmpetition,  its hard to keep all 12 coaches.  When you have OR and sully and daveymac and mbalding and kaveman, etc, etc, etc  beating up on you every year,  you are going to hav some turnover.  in fact,  the one team that didnt make the postseasn has a rookie coach and the last coach pretty much the cupboard bare. 
 Now, Al... first of all you know you are my homie.  and you know i am not one of those guys that thinks D2 and d3 are easy and that all coaches down there suck.  I know that is not true and i know there are some terrific conferenes in d2 and d3 and some great coaches.  but i dont think there is quite the depth of great coaches and yhou dont have to deal with EE.and dont tell me about the recruiting advantage of the power conferences.  The top coaches at the top schools at lower levels have jut as much of advantage, if not more.I cant speak intelligently about d2 recruiting because i havent spent alot of time there.  but d3 recruiting is clearly easier than d1.  especially for the good coaches at the good schools.You know what, i might even grant you that itis just as hard at the lower levels to accomplish 10 NT teams in one year (i really dont think so,  but i will grant you that for now)  but to say that D1 is EASIER is just CRAZY, brother,  CRAZ-EEE.
oldave, d3 recruiting is easier, but its easier for everybody. you are competing against people who also have it easier. i don't see why that makes it harder to get 10 NT teams in a d3 conf which is on equal footing as everybody, compared to a d1 conf with major built in advantages over most other teams in the area...
I don't think its easy to get 10 NT teams in anywhere. Thats a great feat. As for the BCS confs - I find it difficult because these teams regularly beat up on each other in conf play. Its not uncommon to be on the bubble with a 40-50 rpi and an 8-8 conf record going into must-win CT situations.
6/13/2010 2:49 PM
tropicana
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For whatever reason, I'm a terrible DIII recruiter. I'm much better at the higher levels. Also, I am an awful coach at every level.

The last part isn't necessarily germane to the point, but it does bear mentioning.
6/13/2010 2:56 PM
tkimble
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Wow, looks like this big east conference was over-rated. Only got 2 teams to the sweet 16. Still, there will be a lot of recruiting $$.
6/13/2010 4:09 PM
kmasonbx1
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Quote: Originally Posted By tkimble on 6/13/2010Wow, looks like this big east conference was over-rated. Only got 2 teams to the sweet 16. Still, there will be a lot of recruiting $$
Wildly inconsistent results from the sim in a 1 and done situation doesn't mean a conference was overrated. We had two 3 seeds lose to 14 seeds, no 3 seed is a worse team than a 14 seed.
6/13/2010 4:32 PM
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