When I saw this I thought, meh doesn't concern me, I don't play Open Leagues. Eliminating AAA helps level the playing field and takes away the "take advantage of a newbie" strategy by trading for his AAA when the newbie doesn't know the real value of his AAA players. I think it is a good move. So good that I might start playing in Open Leagues again.
And I agree with contrarian, No one would agree to do this in reverse.

Also, there's been no mention of Champs Leagues in all this. I assume they still have AAA? If so, problem solved for AAA fans who've been to the World Series at least 5 times.

Maybe, maybe not contrarian23. I do believe in the valid complaint of it being rammed down our throat unceremoniously with very little notice or awareness. If not for someone finding it buried in seldom used seldom perused "Critical News", many might still not know about it until sprise sprise they entered their next OL with a roster already with AAA in mind, including many who don't wander the forum halls.

That said, my major soapbox to the conv was limited or no trading of them, hedged also with in and of itself I'm not mad at play with what you draft, with half a hedge it'll still bring with it's OL elimination an unnecessary additional battle for the previously OL-only in navigating it's introduction to them in a theme that they'd otherwise encounter a period of beatdowns anyway even if previously familiar with AAA.

But since their OL trading status is no longer an issue, I'm 51/49 ok with this. It would be higher but for poor application of a correct concept. Dynamic pricing remains the bigger better competitive/sketchy gamesmanship elimination fix.

Posted by contrarian23 on 2/20/2021 11:30:00 AM (view original):
I have a hypothesis - completely unprovable.

If the situation were reversed...if the long time status quo was that OLs did not have AAA...and if admin proposed "hey, we're thinking about giving each OL team 8 random players of variable quality and playing time, with disguised names and ratings rather than stats"....I expect that absolutely NO ONE would support that move. And in fact that there would be an uproar.

Similarly, if they were launching OLs from scratch, that is if OLs did not exist at all, and they gave us two options: 80M cap straight up, or 80M cap plus "each team will get 8 random players of variable quality and playing time, with disguised names and ratings rather than stats", I expect very very very few owners would vote for option B.

So honestly I think the real issue here is not the move, it's the fact that it's a change from what people are used to and some people just don't like change in general. When what this game desperately needs is change in general. Yes, some changes will be better than others, some will have unintended consequences, etc., but the absolute worst thing they can do is "nothing." Let's give admin credit for being willing to shake things up.

The difference for me is that pretty much no one is calling for it to stay the same. Removing the fake names alone is a change that nearly every person has asked for. Idk why that couldn’t have been the first step is all

Posted by contrarian23 on 2/20/2021 11:30:00 AM (view original):
I have a hypothesis - completely unprovable.

If the situation were reversed...if the long time status quo was that OLs did not have AAA...and if admin proposed "hey, we're thinking about giving each OL team 8 random players of variable quality and playing time, with disguised names and ratings rather than stats"....I expect that absolutely NO ONE would support that move. And in fact that there would be an uproar.

Similarly, if they were launching OLs from scratch, that is if OLs did not exist at all, and they gave us two options: 80M cap straight up, or 80M cap plus "each team will get 8 random players of variable quality and playing time, with disguised names and ratings rather than stats", I expect very very very few owners would vote for option B.

So honestly I think the real issue here is not the move, it's the fact that it's a change from what people are used to and some people just don't like change in general. When what this game desperately needs is change in general. Yes, some changes will be better than others, some will have unintended consequences, etc., but the absolute worst thing they can do is "nothing." Let's give admin credit for being willing to shake things up.

Contrarian, I agree with you only that if it was starting from scratch the majority would choose not to have the fake name random skill AAA players. But that’s not why I and many others are upset by this decision. I don’t like this change because now we have to draft 6000 PA’s and 1500 IP with the same salary cap where we were drafting 4800-5000 PA’s and 1200-1300 IP.
So the real question to ask is would you rather have weaker players or stronger players?
I dont mind losing the AAA players, I only care about effectively losing the cap to spend. It shouldn’t be too hard for an admin to run a report to see what the average PA and IP drafted has been in the last year or some time period. Then make a simple calculation to see what the average $/PA and $/IP has been. Then just pro-rate the cap upwards from $80 to whatever the calculation tells us. For example if the average has been 5000 PA and 1250 IP, lets assume people split the cap 50%/50% so $40 million for hitting and pitching each. 6000 / 5000 = 1.2, 1.2 x $40M = $48M. 1500 / 1250 = 1.2, 1.2 x $40M = $48M. 48 + 48 = 96. So I think a $96 million cap without AAAplayers would get us the same caliber of players we drafted before the change.

AAA players should just be “human blow out Patches”,...$200,000 to $225,000...They are chosen by the drafters and not charged against our salary cap...The notion of administration randomly assigning AAA players with a value of $1,500,000 is preposterous...

I would never anticipate getting anywhere near 1,000 PA or 100 innings resembling quality from AAA. They are usually a huge disappointment. Folks it isn't a huge change...get over it.

I rarely play open leagues, mainly just to try some combinations for later Champs league teams. Currently have an OL team sitting at 69-34 and haven't called up any of the AAA. I drafted 5329 PA and 1321 IP. It takes daily managing to help ward off fatigue with the pitching staff, but only 3 of my 11 pitchers are currently below 90%. Two of them will be at 100 after 1 more game and the other (a SP) after 2 games.

Like contrarion said, it can be done while still having pretty solid players. Hang in there and do some experimenting...you should get used to the change. Good luck!

Booo! No AAA.. A little surprise is nice. Set up a different league without it.

Posted by contrarian23 on 2/21/2021 10:28:00 AM (view original):
That's silly. I just took an OL team what won ~110 regular season games, made 2 small changes to improve my bench, and easily fit the revised team under the 80M cap.

Misleading, if not a lie. Your final roster came in at exactly 80M, PLUS 15M AAA extensively used.

You did some very nice things with that team that not everyone would know to do even with AAA, which is now not even an option. It's fine that you're ok with no AAA moving forward, but so too are opposing views. No need to tar and feather and name-call and misrepresent valid to them views and their audacity to challenge yours.

I can understand an opposing view, but this is not an insurmountable task to build a roster. The embellishments are indeed silly. There are and will always be leagues available that offer AAA. Give it a chance...if it needs fixing, we will convince Adam to make a change. Many here have been waiting 15 years for improvements to be made. To those who have been here only a short time who want to throw their weight around... I'm only sympathetic up to a point.

Is there a reason AAA can't be an option when joining an OL? OL w/AAA and OL wo/AAA. Let the users decide which OL style they want to play.

Posted by moheakan on 2/21/2021 2:50:00 PM (view original):
Is there a reason AAA can't be an option when joining an OL? OL w/AAA and OL wo/AAA. Let the users decide which OL style they want to play.

You can always create a theme league with old OL rules

Hello,
I heard an ugly rumor that the AAA players are being eliminated in OPEN LEAGUES. Without an increase in CAP ? Fatigue will run rampant !! DON'T DO IT !! This not only is one of my favorite parts of the Open League, but it can be the great equalizer and makes the season much more intriguing.
I can see many owners moving to other formats like Strat-o-matic, etc. if this proceeds, including myself.
How about making it an option with or without AAA players as in Theme things ?
You can then gauge the popularity of such a drastic change by how many choose each option.

Why not let the owners vote on it ??

Pruman1992
Jerry Troilo

Why would fatigue run rampant? Just draft a few more IP and PA