Ethics question Topic

milkamania
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technically that doesn't say it's permitted, it just says it's one of the 2 ways to determine the info.  asking someone who scouted a state you don't want to scout is a way to determine FSS as well, but that's not permitted.  having 2 ID's and using 1 to scout for the other is a way to determine potential, but that's illegal too. 

let's put this to rest, someone ticket Seble and ask specifically, is this OK??  if he says yes, it's yes, if he says no, it's no. 
12/29/2011 11:37 AM
kujayhawk
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Quick reminder that just because something is permissible doesn't necessarily mean it is ethical.
12/29/2011 11:44 AM
jtt8355
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Posted by milkamania on 12/29/2011 11:37:00 AM (view original):
technically that doesn't say it's permitted, it just says it's one of the 2 ways to determine the info.  asking someone who scouted a state you don't want to scout is a way to determine FSS as well, but that's not permitted.  having 2 ID's and using 1 to scout for the other is a way to determine potential, but that's illegal too. 

let's put this to rest, someone ticket Seble and ask specifically, is this OK??  if he says yes, it's yes, if he says no, it's no. 

the zhawks/seble exchange covered this. if you're not satisfied, you're unneccessarily nitpicking.

12/29/2011 11:58 AM
2bounce
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This could all be solved very easily:  They need to change Scouting Trips.  If you do a scouting trip, even for a transfer, you get to see the color coded ratings.  For actual FR it allows you the option of an individual scouting trip, (which in the real world has much more value and detailed information that you would get from a scouting service), at a cheaper price, or scouting all the players in the sate at a discount.  It should also be available for transfers.  Again, in the real world a coach has 30 game films per season he can purchase to scout a transfer.  Why wouldn't you be able to scout a transfer here?  Do real teams just take a transfer without knowing anything about him? No. In some case they may be able to talk to the former coach but in most cases the former coach isn't going to be very cooperative.  And why can't you scout PR (a US Commonwealth) and Canada? It is cheaper to fly to PR and Canada than Alaska, Hawaii, or many other parts of the country.
12/29/2011 12:08 PM (edited)
milkamania
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Posted by jtt8355 on 12/29/2011 11:58:00 AM (view original):
Posted by milkamania on 12/29/2011 11:37:00 AM (view original):
technically that doesn't say it's permitted, it just says it's one of the 2 ways to determine the info.  asking someone who scouted a state you don't want to scout is a way to determine FSS as well, but that's not permitted.  having 2 ID's and using 1 to scout for the other is a way to determine potential, but that's illegal too. 

let's put this to rest, someone ticket Seble and ask specifically, is this OK??  if he says yes, it's yes, if he says no, it's no. 

the zhawks/seble exchange covered this. if you're not satisfied, you're unneccessarily nitpicking.

I'll admit I'm nitpicking, but ethical questions are all about nitpicking.   One person's ethics cause him to see something one way, another person looks at the same situation and sees it differently. 

In Rupp recruiting I just lost out on a transfer player I REALLY wanted.  He was a transfer from Clemson and I was battling a D2 school in my conference.  I used 4 scouting trips to make sure he was worth fighting for, and he was.  Had I  simply sitemailed the Clemson coach for his potentials I would have had about $750 more to spend elsewhere that I didn't use on those scouting trips, but it never even occurred to me to do it as I felt it would be cheating.  Had I done so maybe i win another battle with that extra cash and cost another coach a recruit he really wants. 

I won't hold it against anyone who does it, especially if it is considered OK, and it may put me at a permanent disadvantage, but I really don't see it as any different than asking any coach that has info that isn't public to share it with me in private.  If I didn't FSS the state, or if i didn't scout the transfer/international, then I shouldn't get the info.
12/29/2011 1:19 PM (edited)
jtt8355
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"it never even occurred to me to do it as I felt it would be cheating. " - everyone is on constructive knowledge of everything that's available in the public domain. Mully (and everyone reading this forum) is at an advantage over other players because he chose to read the zhawks/seble exchange. This is not an unfair advantage bc everyone had access to the same response.
12/29/2011 1:59 PM
isack24
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"One person's ethics cause him to see something one way, another person looks at the same situation and sees it differently."
 
Which is exactly why the people who are so adamant that X is "unethical" are wrong.  Ethics are subjective.  There really shouldn't be much dispute about that.

12/29/2011 4:23 PM
seble
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Posted by llamanunts on 12/29/2011 10:49:00 AM (view original):
Posted by mullycj on 12/28/2011 8:37:00 AM (view original):

How will you be able to find out the potential of a Transfer player? (zhawks - Hall of Famer - 2:49 PM)

Scouting services don't cover transfers. That information can only be determined via either traditional recruiting tactics or via sitemailing his old coach.

Right.  How did this get lost in the discussion?  Seems like it's explicitly permitted.
Actually, this chat was before I took over.  I don't think it's appropriate to ask another coach to reveal information about a player that's not readily available to everyone.
12/29/2011 5:51 PM
tianyi7886
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ding ding ding, we have a winner. 
12/29/2011 6:03 PM
isack24
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That still doesn't answer the "ethics" question, but it may very well answer whether it's against WiS' rules.  Of course, if we're analyzing, seble said "I don't think," not "it's not."  Semantics are fun!
12/29/2011 6:08 PM
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caesari
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Take what he means. No one will interpret it as a maybe unless that's the only thing they wanna hear.
12/29/2011 6:36 PM
isack24
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Lawyersack posits that seble's "intent" isn't relevant unless memorialized in rule form.
12/29/2011 6:37 PM
isack24
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Chill out.  I'm just joking.  Seriously, you are constantly spazzing.  Take life (and yourself and everyone else) a little less seriously.
12/29/2011 6:39 PM
isack24
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You're right, I shouldn't tell you what to do.  Be as big of a spaz as you want.
12/29/2011 6:43 PM
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