Most Sucessful HBD GM (updated) Topic

plague
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Quote: Originally posted by hartjh14 on 1/08/2009Sadly, I think mike has a point (outside of selectively excluding teams that is).  I think the best measurement of the best gm is two fold (really more than that, but this is for simplicity's sake).  Someone needs to come up with some magic formula of percentage of playoff appearances, then percentage of championships in those appearances.  Minimum of 10 playoff appearances.Getting to the playoffs is fantastic.  Winning in the playoffs is the ultimate goal.  Find some way to combine the 2 and you'll at least be able to make a valid claim to being a top GM.  It won't say who's #1 and who's #20, but it will let you know who the top GMs are (with a few exceptions - mike is a top GM no matter how many playoff failures he has).


You will never be able to come up with a formula that can be even remotely accurate. When you start factoring stuff together like quality of worlds and quality of teams the coach inherited. I would also add in the quality of teams the coach . How many world series did a coach win at the cost of improving the future of a team. I have seen coaches have 5 or 6 winning seasons then leave a team in shambles for the next coach, would that coach be considered great if he wins 2 or 3 world series in the process? What about coaches who have multiple seasons of abandon teams on their record?

When it comes down to it I think you will never have a accurate formula for judging the top coaches. Probably the best judge would be a council of 20-25 top owners who do a AP type voting system of top coaches, and that would still be subjective for those coaches would most likely be heavily influenced by coaches they have played against in their own worlds.
1/8/2009 11:58 AM
MikeT23
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Seriously, if you haven't played against a guy, how do you really know how good he is?

1/8/2009 12:04 PM
mrdanielx
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Quote: Originally posted by MikeT23 on 1/08/2009You're not tanking now because I called you on it.   You were something like 11-34 at one point.

Slow start... move a couple highly rated cancers, got over a couple early injuries, and now I am solidly mediocre.
1/8/2009 12:05 PM
MikeT23
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Every tanker has a reason. And every tanker somehow "resolves" his issues when called out publicly. Just like you did.
1/8/2009 12:07 PM
sche0707
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Quote: Originally posted by pstrnutbag44 on 1/08/2009Hell, if we can exclude "replacements" I might actually find my way pretty high up there, surprisingly. Every team that I have ever run that was not a replacement has been a first place team, except for 1 season that I placed second. I have also been a "replacement" and have been able to take abandoned teams to the playoffs the same year they were abandoned (more than once) and even took one abandoned team all the way and won the WS. So, it's a double edged sword for me. No abandoned teams on my record, and overall, my record would be outstanding (Only Major Leagues seasons 1-6, Negro Leagues seasons 6-8, Hamilton Season 1 combine for an overall 853-605 record, or .709 winning pct.), however no abandoned teams on my record, and I'd have no WS championship.


I'm going to ask you once to stop talking about that fluke of WS. It didn't count I was the real winner dammit.
1/8/2009 12:14 PM
mrdanielx
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Quote: Originally posted by MikeT23 on 1/08/2009Every tanker has a reason.   And every tanker somehow "resolves" his issues when called out publicly.   Just like you did.
If you pulled your head out of your arse and looked at my transactions you would see. I have never tanked. Taken over craptacular teams and performed poorly? Yes... tanked for draft picks? No.
1/8/2009 12:17 PM
mrdanielx
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Quote: Originally posted by sche0707 on 1/08/2009
Quote: Originally posted by pstrnutbag44 on 1/08/2009Hell, if we can exclude "replacements" I might actually find my way pretty high up there, surprisingly. Every team that I have ever run that was not a replacement has been a first place team, except for 1 season that I placed second. I have also been a "replacement" and have been able to take abandoned teams to the playoffs the same year they were abandoned (more than once) and even took one abandoned team all the way and won the WS. So, it's a double edged sword for me. No abandoned teams on my record, and overall, my record would be outstanding (Only Major Leagues seasons 1-6, Negro Leagues seasons 6-8, Hamilton Season 1 combine for an overall 853-605 record, or .709 winning pct.), however no abandoned teams on my record, and I'd have no WS championship.

I'm going to ask you once to stop talking about that fluke of WS. It didn't count I was the real winner dammit.

Your **** talking lead to poetic justice.
1/8/2009 12:18 PM
plague
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Quote: Originally posted by MikeT23 on 1/08/2009Seriously, if you haven't played against a guy, how do you really know how good he is? 


Same way writers in college football pick the top 25 in the AP poll. It will never be accurate, but if you have 20-25 people who you consider knowledgable in HBD and willing to spend the time doing research, you can come up with a better ranking system than any formula anyone on these forums could come up with in ranking the top coaches. I am saying nothing will be perfect, but I think what I suggested would be the better system.
1/8/2009 12:23 PM
MikeT23
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I'm around a lot(obviously). I can't think of one owner that I haven't played against that I'd list in my top 25.
1/8/2009 12:25 PM
cademord
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I'm willing to bet that I'm the only model who also has HBD teams. That makes me by far the most successful.
1/8/2009 12:26 PM
pstrnutbag44
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Quote: Originally Posted By mrdanielx on 1/08/2009
Quote: Originally posted by sche0707 on 1/08/2009
Quote: Originally posted by pstrnutbag44 on 1/08/2009Hell, if we can exclude "replacements" I might actually find my way pretty high up there, surprisingly. Every team that I have ever run that was not a replacement has been a first place team, except for 1 season that I placed second. I have also been a "replacement" and have been able to take abandoned teams to the playoffs the same year they were abandoned (more than once) and even took one abandoned team all the way and won the WS. So, it's a double edged sword for me. No abandoned teams on my record, and overall, my record would be outstanding (Only Major Leagues seasons 1-6, Negro Leagues seasons 6-8, Hamilton Season 1 combine for an overall 853-605 record, or .709 winning pct.), however no abandoned teams on my record, and I'd have no WS championship.

I'm going to ask you once to stop talking about that fluke of WS. It didn't count I was the real winner dammit.

Your **** talking lead to poetic justice.
No, he sealed his fate by not including my team in the "Playoff Odds" post on the blog after I declared I was taking the then sub .500 team to the playoffs. When I asked about my odds at making it to the WS, I was boldly given 60:1 I believe....
1/8/2009 12:27 PM
plague
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Quote: Originally posted by MikeT23 on 1/08/2009I'm around a lot(obviously).   I can't think of one owner that I haven't played against that I'd list in my top 25.

That could be true, and I think you would be a worthy person to do voting of this kind. However I think its possible if you did the reasonable research it would take to do objectionable voting you would probably consider others. If your just voting based on your experiences then you will never be objectionable.
1/8/2009 12:42 PM
iain
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Quote: Originally Posted By plague on 1/08/2009
Quote: Originally posted by MikeT23 on 1/08/2009
I'm around a lot(obviously). I can't think of one owner that I haven't played against that I'd list in my top 25.

That could be true, and I think you would be a worthy person to do voting of this kind. However I think its possible if you did the reasonable research it would take to do objectionable voting you would probably consider others. If your just voting based on your experiences then you will never be objectionable
I'd argue that MikeT will always be objectionable.

Objective? Well, if you're not supposed to use your own, who's experience are you supposed to weigh when voting?
1/8/2009 1:05 PM
MikeT23
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Quote: Originally Posted By plague on 1/08/2009
Quote: Originally posted by MikeT23 on 1/08/2009
I'm around a lot(obviously). I can't think of one owner that I haven't played against that I'd list in my top 25.

That could be true, and I think you would be a worthy person to do voting of this kind. However I think its possible if you did the reasonable research it would take to do objectionable voting you would probably consider others. If your just voting based on your experiences then you will never be objectionable


Here's a couple of examples:
1. Big Thunder-I know virtually nothing of the guy. But he won a handful of WS early on. Joined MoneyBall(not a league I'm in but I'm familiar with many of the owners). Gave up the team in spring training(or early in the season). He may be a fantastic owner who had to give up his team due to personal circumstances. However, here's my take: He dominated a bunch of 'tard worlds by traderaping n00bs/dumbasses. Joined a competitive world, realized he wouldn't be able to build his team in his accustomed manner and moved on.
2. 7Yankee7-Played against him in Aaron in season 1(and now about 50 games in ABU). Won a handful of World Series and created 30 leagues. a bad taste in a lot of mouths by jacking up payroll, offering long-term deals and leaving the world before those deals turned bad.

Both of these guys may be top owners. They've been successful and the numbers would prove it. But neither would make my top 25 because of the last sentence in each of their summaries. As for me, I might make some lists. And I'd be off of some because "He's a forum ***!" I doubt I'm Top 25, and have a lack of WS titles to prove it, but I shouldn't be excluded because I called your dumbass idea the work of a 'tard.
1/8/2009 1:22 PM
mrdanielx
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Threester should be added to the BigThunder, 7Yankee7, list of questionable owners.
1/8/2009 1:44 PM
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