Quote: Originally Posted By strikeout26 on 11/06/2009
So, you are telling me that you do not try to get the better end of every trade. I understand that there are trades where both sides get equal value, but you cannot sit there and tell me that every player that plays the game is not trying to get the better deal in a trade. I might have very little experience in HBD, but I have many years of competitive experience in the game of baseball.

In a perfect world with 32 equally experienced owners your statement would be true. However, in the make believe of HBD, when carried to its logical extention as "traderape" of new owners (who do not know the value of players) it leads to gross imbalances in a "world" that can not be easily resolved - particularly if the trade rape is ongoing. Another way of looking at this - trade sex, good and necessary for the survival of the species. Trade rape, bad and detrimental to the species.

In the original Trash Heap Challenge the messed up franchises could be made competitive with the average team in the league in 3 seasons but after 7 seasons could not challenge the original "rapists". This type of permanent imbalance from uncontrolled trape rape permanently destroys leagues. Figuring out whether a single trade is traderape is difficult but the pattern is easy to spot. In a private world the rapist should be prosecuted and removed by the commish at the next rollover. In a public world this can not happen. Any world that harbors a traderapist should be avoided - public or private - and the other owners should vote with their feet.

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Worlds I commish have a no trade rape policy (which might be better defined as a no statutory rape policy) - sounds like you should stear clear of these worlds.

Plagues attitude is why new owners need to be extremely careful of trading in their 1st or 2nd year and careful about what worlds they join. In a public world if the same owners always finish on top and are always trading with new owners - think trade (statutory) rape

(If you suspect trade statutory rape look for the telltale data: go to world center - find a league (fyc) the person is in and the team your interested in checking out (Dover)(hmm 4 straight division titles). Then go to world office, reports, trade history and enter Dover. In year 13 we find that Dover obtained a newbie owners number one draft pick from a previous year. In year 11 he obtained a previous number 1 pick in the entire draft from a newbie owner. Conclusion all the appearance of statutory trade rape - avoid trading with this owner and personally I would look for another world to join)

This attitude is appropriate for a "no Newbie" private world. The owners should be able to take care of themselves. For most public worlds trade rape is near universal and is the death to any semblence of competitive balance(it is an unual public world that develops a no trade rape Ethos). A private world that accepts newbie owners (recognizing that 1/2 of them won't survive to the second year) will either have a no trade rape (no statutory rape) policy or become a tard world.

I've determined that plague is a 'tard who likes to argue. What's he saying is he should be allowed to offer three training camp pitchers for three #1 draft picks to a new owner. If it's accepted and fails to get 10 vetoes, he's done his job as an owner.

Ridiculous.

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That's stupid. YOU don't give a damn about the health of a world. Join Foxx and applaude what's going on over there.

I'll leave it at that.

I don't care about Foxx, and I not interested in policing their world, I am also not currently looking to join any other world. I think its unfair to blame that owner for winning within the rules of the game. I am assuming he has played within the rules of the game. I also would not be scared away because a owner is dominating a world, I have enough self confidence that I would eventually build a competitive team.

I do care about the health of the world that I am participating, I don't consider a world healthy that places unfair restrictions on certain owners. If a trade is lopsided owners should veto and stop the trade in its tracks, don't whine about it after the fact. I would never place blame on a owner for trading but place blame on the owners for not vetoeing. I think blame has been misplaced here and that people are wanting to blame someone for winning, to me it looks like jealousy.

I'm not reading all that but I can't "leave it at that" as I previously claimed.

You are a veteran owner that plays in public worlds. So you're going to run across the occassional n00b. I'd feel a responsibility to help him learn the game so the HBD customer base can be increased with good owners. You, on the other hand, have no problem at all in helping him destroy his team with lopsided offers and ruin his first season. Some people are going to say "F this", quit and find something else to do with the extra money and time. Good job on you.

Quote: Originally Posted By plague on 11/06/2009
I would never place blame on a owner for trading but place blame on the owners for not vetoeing. I think blame has been misplaced here and that people are wanting to blame someone for winning, to me it looks like jealousy.

I guess if you want to make an analogy from the above statement, then it's OK for a grown person to steal an eight year old's lunch money as long as other people see it happening and don't say anything or try to stop it.

In other words, apathy on the part of other people makes the action itself acceptable.

Is that your argument?

Owners that say "F this" and find something else is a weak owner, he has no confidence in his ability and is looking for the easy road to victory. Failure is part of learning.

New owners have to desire to be helped. I have played these games long enough. Too many owners come in with no experience and think they understand everything. If I am playing a game that I do not understand I proceed with caution. When someone sends me a message asking for help I will help them, but they have to want to be helped.

Here is the type of owner who will get better. He is someone who learned from his mistakes. He is also the owner that Grimfvd made mention. Here is a chat that he sent to me and my response. I out the chat that did not involve this trade.

tonicawf 9/23/2009 7:25 PM why oh why,
tonicawf 9/23/2009 7:25 PM did i trade Stan Garland to you? probably my dumbest trade ever. im not mad at you or anything, good on you to improve your team, but i wish i had him. im sitting here beating myself up. oh well, live and learn. my G.M. I.Q. has grown,
tonicawf 9/23/2009 7:25 PM and i feel like i have a grasp on this game now and how i should run my team, and looking back, this trade was my wake up call. good luck this season, but i think the world series trophy that was stolen from you last season is yours this season.

plague 9/23/2009 7:42 PM In the league I commish I usually advise people to not trade their first season. New coach trades with veteran coach, who do you think is likely to get the better of that deal?

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You say they're weak owners. I say they're inexperienced owners who get taken. I'd try to help them. You'd bend them over and say "Well, failure is part of learning. Bad on you."

Good job.

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