Posted by asher413 on 1/12/2011 1:43:00 PM (view original):
Just a couple of thoughts I have-

1. Where are the fair play guidelines listed?  I couldn't find them for this topic.  I just don't know if FSS sharing is or isn't against the guidelines.

2. To be fair, I don't think anyone should have two IDs in the same world and division.  33 teams are plenty, and if that's not enough for you... well... then maybe we need to have an intervention.  And I don't even think people should be allowed to add additional IDs to worlds (now that there are PLENTY).  I understand that some people have had two for years, and I don't think anyone should be forced to remove an ID that they've had for more than 3 seasons in a world.  But I'm an optimist, and would like to believe that 98% of the people with multiple accounts are doing everything they can to not create a benefit for themselves that way.  Can/Should they adjust the system for that 2%?

3. Every loophole can't be closed.  Period.  Some people will ALWAYS find a way to push the limits of the system.  Sometimes this is cheating, other times this is being very smart.  Outside of monitoring every activity from every IP address, and having staff review every single time we log in what we do, it will happen.

4. I'm not sure if the FSS system should change for the reasons in this thread.  We are likely talking about 5-10 people a world and at MOST 100 total that have multiple accounts that could be in a position to actually take advantage of this.  I personally dislike FSS/potential, but this is not the reason to change the system.

Now, if FSS sharing is against fair play guidelines, how is it enforced?  Word of mouth?  Reporting?  I don't believe WIS has the staff to enforce that rule, and it does come down to users stepping up.

Posted by jaisonline on 1/12/2011 3:25:00 PM (view original):
I am sorta  against having 2 or more teams in one world. Why ?  It is just way to easy to cheat during recruiting w/ FSS

For example, I coach a D1 Prov school in Tark.  My dad coaches a D2 school also in Tark (I help him).   note: I have informed tech support upfront when my father started playing HD in Tark about us having two teams in the same world

If either one of us were cheaters, I (or he) can easily use my Prov FSS account (since I have ample money in D1 to buy FSS states) to scout D2 players regardless of distance.  That would put him at a huge advantage over his D2 peers.  It is so easy to do (login to 1 account using Firefox and the other using IE.  Then align the windows).  It is just too tempting...

I assume it comes down to putting trust in fellow coaches that what I typed above isn't done.

If people want to win at any costs, they'll find ways around restrictions (Nothing would prevent someone from signing up to WIS on a completely new account and joining the same world). 

I think the better thing to do would be to associate some other type of benefit to spending your recruiting dollars via FSS (perhaps a bump in prestige when talking to recruits in that scouted state).  That way if someone wants to circumvent the spending of FSS scouting (by using another account), they are at some disadvantage by not using those dollars on FSS over someone who does.

An interesting discussion, I'll throw in my two cents.  I don't think WiS will ever be able to stop cheating because of the hundred different ways it can be done, but it strikes me that a fairly easy way to deal with FSS information sharing is to give each team more recruiting money, but money that can only be used for FSS (a separate, set-aside "scouting" pool).  Figure out how much money a team would have to spend to scout all fifty states, then give each team some percentage of that amount (30%? - the percentage is negotiable) as their scouting budget.

This would add strategic decisions with respect to how to spend the money.  Use it to scout a few big states?  Just local states?  A bunch of small states?  Use it up front to find guys with good potential?  Or wait until after signings, so that the number of recruits have dwindled and you can scout more states? - but then you are running the risk that a lot of the high-potential guys are gone.

Obviously it wouldn't make the problem go away.  Three cheaters (or one with three ID's) could get together and have information on all fifty states, if the amount was set at 35% or so.  But I think it would put clean coaches at a smaller disadvantage, and add some strategic decisions as mentioned earlier.
 
I think this is more interesting than making FSS free for everyone, because it adds the decision on how to spend the scouting budget.

Posted by buddhagamer on 1/12/2011 4:11:00 PM (view original):

If people want to win at any costs, they'll find ways around restrictions (Nothing would prevent someone from signing up to WIS on a completely new account and joining the same world). 

I think the better thing to do would be to associate some other type of benefit to spending your recruiting dollars via FSS (perhaps a bump in prestige when talking to recruits in that scouted state).  That way if someone wants to circumvent the spending of FSS scouting (by using another account), they are at some disadvantage by not using those dollars on FSS over someone who does.

Posted by kannc6 on 1/12/2011 4:29:00 PM (view original):
The value of multiple accounts is much higher in D3 than in D2 and even moreso for D1 due to the huge $ difference in each class. The simplest solution would be to cut  FSS for D3. There are many other reasons to cut FSS in D3 as well, but that's my $.02

I'm not sure how you could do this.  If you disallow D3 coaches from using FSS but the recruits can still be scouted by a colluding D1 or D2 coach (or simply a coach with multiple ID's, one of them being above D3), then cheating will still take place.  On the other hand, if you simply don't let D3 recruits get scouted at all, you have the problem that recruits drop from D2 to D3 as time passes, or are listed as D2 for low-prestige D3 teams but D3 for high-prestige D3 teams.  How would you handle them?

Posted by buddhagamer on 1/12/2011 4:11:00 PM (view original):

If people want to win at any costs, they'll find ways around restrictions (Nothing would prevent someone from signing up to WIS on a completely new account and joining the same world). 

I think the better thing to do would be to associate some other type of benefit to spending your recruiting dollars via FSS (perhaps a bump in prestige when talking to recruits in that scouted state).  That way if someone wants to circumvent the spending of FSS scouting (by using another account), they are at some disadvantage by not using those dollars on FSS over someone who does.

+1.   FSS giving a recruitin boost in that state would be great.  The boost should be more than phone calls/letters, but less than a targeted SV.  Essentially, you are doing SV for the whole state, so the players should notice your school and that should give you some boost, but not as much as if the player knows you are targeting them specifically.

Posted by tianyi7886 on 1/18/2011 7:48:00 PM (view original):
Yep he still has all his teams, and he has refused my request to show his FSS states for each team after he signed all his players. 

Posted by cthomas22255 on 1/18/2011 9:53:00 PM (view original):
WIS is a business.  Restricting teams/world is the equivalent to telling your customer "No, you can't buy any more of my product even though there's plenty on the shelf."  Never going to happen. 

Coaches like Vandydave have multiple teams under multiple IDs and spend thousands annually on this game.  WIS isn't going to tick off their biggest customers. 

As OR pointed out, there are other ways to cheat and anyone can share FSS info with a willing coach in secret.  The risk of other coaches cheating or colluding  is just part of the game.