Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 3:08:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 2:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 2:41:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmax on 12/19/2016 2:31:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 12:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 11:34:00 AM (view original):
It's a dying game as the results of their changes. I don't think it will make a difference even if they change it back or make improvements to fix the mistakes they made. Most people won't want to start their dynasty over.

Maybe they made changes because it was a dying game. That's my guess.

I agree that the game was in decline. I think WIS could have avoided the decline by making some efforts over the last 3-4 years to market the game.

BUT, the game clearly needed to be better suited to mobile devices

AND, the game clearly needed improvement.

I would have preferred significant marketing coupled with iterative more modest improvements, but without change the game was going no where.

In my opinion the game was severely underpopulated but I wouldn't call it dying. It all comes down to the marketing. The game could have done well as it was previously designed but people just didn't learn about it. I NEVER see a flash ad from whatifsports when I'm browsing the internet and I'm an actual user on the site which means that they clearly aren't marketing to people based on their cookies.

It doesn't really all come down to marketing. I knew about the game and had no interest. The game tilted heavily in favor of the "big" schools and, if you got there too late, your fate was set. If you were content to go 20-11 while 15-20 schools went 33-1 or 32-2 while rotating in the E8 you could play. If you hoped to get a shot at the F4, you had to hope a user died so you could get one of those schools.

And, FWIW, no one can scream "Realism!!!" and have coaches at the same school for 60-80 seasons. I'm sure term limits at schools would have went over really well.

You knew about the game because you were already a WIS user. Most of their growth would come from bringing new people to the site that didn't even know it existed. It really does come down to marketing. The only problem is that now they have a junk game to market.

We have this discussion in HBD all the time. This is a niche' market. Someone wanting to play a CBB sim probably knows how to use a search engine. If they want to play one, they'll find it.

I do think they could do a better job marketing the game but I don't think there's any way on earth that any marketing ploy will flood this site with new users.

And, of course, if anyone did show up and read these forums, they'd never play. This is easily the most negative forum I've seen in my 14ish years here.

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 2:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 2:41:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmax on 12/19/2016 2:31:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 12:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 11:34:00 AM (view original):
It's a dying game as the results of their changes. I don't think it will make a difference even if they change it back or make improvements to fix the mistakes they made. Most people won't want to start their dynasty over.

Maybe they made changes because it was a dying game. That's my guess.

I agree that the game was in decline. I think WIS could have avoided the decline by making some efforts over the last 3-4 years to market the game.

BUT, the game clearly needed to be better suited to mobile devices

AND, the game clearly needed improvement.

I would have preferred significant marketing coupled with iterative more modest improvements, but without change the game was going no where.

In my opinion the game was severely underpopulated but I wouldn't call it dying. It all comes down to the marketing. The game could have done well as it was previously designed but people just didn't learn about it. I NEVER see a flash ad from whatifsports when I'm browsing the internet and I'm an actual user on the site which means that they clearly aren't marketing to people based on their cookies.

It doesn't really all come down to marketing. I knew about the game and had no interest. The game tilted heavily in favor of the "big" schools and, if you got there too late, your fate was set. If you were content to go 20-11 while 15-20 schools went 33-1 or 32-2 while rotating in the E8 you could play. If you hoped to get a shot at the F4, you had to hope a user died so you could get one of those schools.

And, FWIW, no one can scream "Realism!!!" and have coaches at the same school for 60-80 seasons. I'm sure term limits at schools would have went over really well.

For Mike and spud why don't you guys just win more? I took 2 different D+ BCS schools and turned them into A schools recently, I did it against these so called "I got here 1st" elite schools. It sounds more and more that you guys just suck at the game and don't want to take the time to learn it and get better. So u wanted seble to make it so u could compete but that still hasn't worked.

I guess if I were you too I would just win more, sounds pretty easy to me

Example from wooden

91	waykbordr	19-11	9-5	8-4	2-2	10-6		55	42	A-	NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
90	waykbordr	21-11	10-3	7-6	4-2	8-8		33	33	A-	NT At-large Bid NT (2nd Round)
89	waykbordr	24-8	14-1	5-6	5-1	11-5	11	9	9	A-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Sweet 16)
88	waykbordr	25-7	11-1	9-5	5-1	11-5	11	9	14	A-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Sweet 16)
87	waykbordr	21-8	16-2	4-4	1-2	12-4	24	28	21	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
86	waykbordr	22-8	13-2	7-4	2-2	11-5		51	79	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
85	waykbordr	22-8	11-3	9-3	2-2	11-5		29	39	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (Sweet 16)
84	waykbordr	22-11	11-3	8-7	3-1	7-9		32	28	B	PI Champion
83	waykbordr	20-12	14-3	5-7	1-2	9-7		56	57	B	PI (Final Four)
82	waykbordr	14-13	7-6	7-6	0-1	6-10		107	86	B+
81	waykbordr	18-12	10-3	6-7	2-2	11-5		35	12	B+	NT At-large Bid NT (2nd Round)
80	waykbordr	23-9	12-3	6-5	5-1	10-6	24	20	19	B+	CT Champion NT (2nd Round)
79	waykbordr	21-9	10-3	9-4	2-2	11-5		35	42	B	NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
78	waykbordr	16-13	4-5	12-7	0-1	6-10		86	100	B-	PI (2nd Round)
77	waykbordr	14-16	8-8	5-7	1-1	5-11		78	30	B-	PI (2nd Round)
76	waykbordr	17-13	12-4	3-7	2-2	6-10		57	21	C+	NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
75	waykbordr	12-15	9-7	3-7	0-1	5-11		150	81	C
74	waykbordr	11-16	9-8	2-7	0-1	2-14		184	100	C
73	waykbordr	11-16	11-5	0-10	0-1	4-12		177	86	C
72	waykbordr	15-14	8-5	6-8	1-1	6-10		105	73	C	PI (1st Round)
71	waykbordr	10-17	5-9	5-7	0-1	5-11		180	108	D+
70	waykbordr	4-23	4-13	0-9	0-1	1-15		266	84	D+
69	waykbordr	5-22	1-11	4-10	0-1	0-16		187	57	D+
68	Sim AI	2-25	1-13	1-11	0-1	0-16

Example from iba

90	all2matt	21-10	12-3	6-5	3-2	10-6		23	14	A-	NT At-large Bid NT (2nd Round)
89	all2matt	18-11	11-4	6-5	1-2	11-5		32	18	B+	NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
88	all2matt	26-5	14-2	8-2	4-1	13-3	15	19	42	B+	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (2nd Round)
87	all2matt	20-9	14-3	5-4	1-2	12-4		28	26	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (2nd Round)
86	all2matt	14-16	9-7	4-8	1-1	5-11		80	27	B	PI (2nd Round)
85	all2matt	15-15	8-9	7-5	0-1	7-9		84	45	B	PI (3rd Round)
84	all2matt	23-7	16-2	5-3	2-2	12-4	21	24	21	B	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (2nd Round)
83	all2matt	21-11	15-5	4-5	2-1	8-8		63	69	C	PI (3rd Round)
82	all2matt	11-16	3-6	8-9	0-1	4-12		172	145	D+
81	all2matt	3-24	3-12	0-11	0-1	2-14		261	68	D+
80	Sim AI	0-27	0-14	0-12	0-1	0-16		281	69	C-
79	Sim AI	7-20	2-10	5-9	0-1

Posted by all2matt on 12/19/2016 4:17:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 2:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 2:41:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmax on 12/19/2016 2:31:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 12:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 11:34:00 AM (view original):
It's a dying game as the results of their changes. I don't think it will make a difference even if they change it back or make improvements to fix the mistakes they made. Most people won't want to start their dynasty over.

Maybe they made changes because it was a dying game. That's my guess.

I agree that the game was in decline. I think WIS could have avoided the decline by making some efforts over the last 3-4 years to market the game.

BUT, the game clearly needed to be better suited to mobile devices

AND, the game clearly needed improvement.

I would have preferred significant marketing coupled with iterative more modest improvements, but without change the game was going no where.

In my opinion the game was severely underpopulated but I wouldn't call it dying. It all comes down to the marketing. The game could have done well as it was previously designed but people just didn't learn about it. I NEVER see a flash ad from whatifsports when I'm browsing the internet and I'm an actual user on the site which means that they clearly aren't marketing to people based on their cookies.

It doesn't really all come down to marketing. I knew about the game and had no interest. The game tilted heavily in favor of the "big" schools and, if you got there too late, your fate was set. If you were content to go 20-11 while 15-20 schools went 33-1 or 32-2 while rotating in the E8 you could play. If you hoped to get a shot at the F4, you had to hope a user died so you could get one of those schools.

And, FWIW, no one can scream "Realism!!!" and have coaches at the same school for 60-80 seasons. I'm sure term limits at schools would have went over really well.

For Mike and spud why don't you guys just win more? I took 2 different D+ BCS schools and turned them into A schools recently, I did it against these so called "I got here 1st" elite schools. It sounds more and more that you guys just suck at the game and don't want to take the time to learn it and get better. So u wanted seble to make it so u could compete but that still hasn't worked.

I guess if I were you too I would just win more, sounds pretty easy to me

Because that would require work and skill?

Posted by waykbordr on 12/19/2016 4:21:00 PM (view original):
Example from wooden

91	waykbordr	19-11	9-5	8-4	2-2	10-6		55	42	A-	NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
90	waykbordr	21-11	10-3	7-6	4-2	8-8		33	33	A-	NT At-large Bid NT (2nd Round)
89	waykbordr	24-8	14-1	5-6	5-1	11-5	11	9	9	A-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Sweet 16)
88	waykbordr	25-7	11-1	9-5	5-1	11-5	11	9	14	A-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Sweet 16)
87	waykbordr	21-8	16-2	4-4	1-2	12-4	24	28	21	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
86	waykbordr	22-8	13-2	7-4	2-2	11-5		51	79	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
85	waykbordr	22-8	11-3	9-3	2-2	11-5		29	39	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (Sweet 16)
84	waykbordr	22-11	11-3	8-7	3-1	7-9		32	28	B	PI Champion
83	waykbordr	20-12	14-3	5-7	1-2	9-7		56	57	B	PI (Final Four)
82	waykbordr	14-13	7-6	7-6	0-1	6-10		107	86	B+
81	waykbordr	18-12	10-3	6-7	2-2	11-5		35	12	B+	NT At-large Bid NT (2nd Round)
80	waykbordr	23-9	12-3	6-5	5-1	10-6	24	20	19	B+	CT Champion NT (2nd Round)
79	waykbordr	21-9	10-3	9-4	2-2	11-5		35	42	B	NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
78	waykbordr	16-13	4-5	12-7	0-1	6-10		86	100	B-	PI (2nd Round)
77	waykbordr	14-16	8-8	5-7	1-1	5-11		78	30	B-	PI (2nd Round)
76	waykbordr	17-13	12-4	3-7	2-2	6-10		57	21	C+	NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
75	waykbordr	12-15	9-7	3-7	0-1	5-11		150	81	C
74	waykbordr	11-16	9-8	2-7	0-1	2-14		184	100	C
73	waykbordr	11-16	11-5	0-10	0-1	4-12		177	86	C
72	waykbordr	15-14	8-5	6-8	1-1	6-10		105	73	C	PI (1st Round)
71	waykbordr	10-17	5-9	5-7	0-1	5-11		180	108	D+
70	waykbordr	4-23	4-13	0-9	0-1	1-15		266	84	D+
69	waykbordr	5-22	1-11	4-10	0-1	0-16		187	57	D+
68	Sim AI	2-25	1-13	1-11	0-1	0-16

I haven't taken a team with that pedigree and tried to build it yet. Seems like the most fun. But I am leaning towards landing a new gig at UNC Wilimington to learn the 2-3 zone. Which most of the conference hasn't had a long term coach and it'll implement as the best coach in the conference before I try to advertise the conference in the forums. A team that I have tried to build to A/A-/A+ has been a C- team or higher.

The problem is/was not that new people couldn't compete it was that they had to work at it, the best accomplishments are always the hardest. If I had chosen to move to other teams with better baselines it may be easy to win going foreword but that's not as fun as doing with the "dynasty" I built. If you don't take the time to build your own team then you can't complain. Most people leaving have built their own dynasties just to see them get demolished by the new system (stewdog @ GaTech in iba) because other users failed to learn the game.

Once I learned how to do it at VaTech in the ACC in wooden it made it easier to do in Iba at Ole Miss in the SEC. It sucked those 1st 8 seasons getting my brains beat in but it made me appreciate the 5 str8 division championships even more

Posted by all2matt on 12/19/2016 4:17:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 2:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 2:41:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmax on 12/19/2016 2:31:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 12:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 11:34:00 AM (view original):
It's a dying game as the results of their changes. I don't think it will make a difference even if they change it back or make improvements to fix the mistakes they made. Most people won't want to start their dynasty over.

Maybe they made changes because it was a dying game. That's my guess.

I agree that the game was in decline. I think WIS could have avoided the decline by making some efforts over the last 3-4 years to market the game.

BUT, the game clearly needed to be better suited to mobile devices

AND, the game clearly needed improvement.

I would have preferred significant marketing coupled with iterative more modest improvements, but without change the game was going no where.

In my opinion the game was severely underpopulated but I wouldn't call it dying. It all comes down to the marketing. The game could have done well as it was previously designed but people just didn't learn about it. I NEVER see a flash ad from whatifsports when I'm browsing the internet and I'm an actual user on the site which means that they clearly aren't marketing to people based on their cookies.

It doesn't really all come down to marketing. I knew about the game and had no interest. The game tilted heavily in favor of the "big" schools and, if you got there too late, your fate was set. If you were content to go 20-11 while 15-20 schools went 33-1 or 32-2 while rotating in the E8 you could play. If you hoped to get a shot at the F4, you had to hope a user died so you could get one of those schools.

And, FWIW, no one can scream "Realism!!!" and have coaches at the same school for 60-80 seasons. I'm sure term limits at schools would have went over really well.

For Mike and spud why don't you guys just win more? I took 2 different D+ BCS schools and turned them into A schools recently, I did it against these so called "I got here 1st" elite schools. It sounds more and more that you guys just suck at the game and don't want to take the time to learn it and get better. So u wanted seble to make it so u could compete but that still hasn't worked.

I guess if I were you too I would just win more, sounds pretty easy to me

Uh, this was my first season in 10 years. Maybe you should understand what you're talking about before you start posting.

Posted by CoachWard95 on 12/19/2016 4:28:00 PM (view original):

Posted by waykbordr on 12/19/2016 4:21:00 PM (view original):
Example from wooden

91	waykbordr	19-11	9-5	8-4	2-2	10-6		55	42	A-	NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
90	waykbordr	21-11	10-3	7-6	4-2	8-8		33	33	A-	NT At-large Bid NT (2nd Round)
89	waykbordr	24-8	14-1	5-6	5-1	11-5	11	9	9	A-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Sweet 16)
88	waykbordr	25-7	11-1	9-5	5-1	11-5	11	9	14	A-	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Sweet 16)
87	waykbordr	21-8	16-2	4-4	1-2	12-4	24	28	21	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
86	waykbordr	22-8	13-2	7-4	2-2	11-5		51	79	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
85	waykbordr	22-8	11-3	9-3	2-2	11-5		29	39	B+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (Sweet 16)
84	waykbordr	22-11	11-3	8-7	3-1	7-9		32	28	B	PI Champion
83	waykbordr	20-12	14-3	5-7	1-2	9-7		56	57	B	PI (Final Four)
82	waykbordr	14-13	7-6	7-6	0-1	6-10		107	86	B+
81	waykbordr	18-12	10-3	6-7	2-2	11-5		35	12	B+	NT At-large Bid NT (2nd Round)
80	waykbordr	23-9	12-3	6-5	5-1	10-6	24	20	19	B+	CT Champion NT (2nd Round)
79	waykbordr	21-9	10-3	9-4	2-2	11-5		35	42	B	NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
78	waykbordr	16-13	4-5	12-7	0-1	6-10		86	100	B-	PI (2nd Round)
77	waykbordr	14-16	8-8	5-7	1-1	5-11		78	30	B-	PI (2nd Round)
76	waykbordr	17-13	12-4	3-7	2-2	6-10		57	21	C+	NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
75	waykbordr	12-15	9-7	3-7	0-1	5-11		150	81	C
74	waykbordr	11-16	9-8	2-7	0-1	2-14		184	100	C
73	waykbordr	11-16	11-5	0-10	0-1	4-12		177	86	C
72	waykbordr	15-14	8-5	6-8	1-1	6-10		105	73	C	PI (1st Round)
71	waykbordr	10-17	5-9	5-7	0-1	5-11		180	108	D+
70	waykbordr	4-23	4-13	0-9	0-1	1-15		266	84	D+
69	waykbordr	5-22	1-11	4-10	0-1	0-16		187	57	D+
68	Sim AI	2-25	1-13	1-11	0-1	0-16

I haven't taken a team with that pedigree and tried to build it yet. Seems like the most fun. But I am leaning towards landing a new gig at UNC Wilimington to learn the 2-3 zone. Which most of the conference hasn't had a long term coach and it'll implement as the best coach in the conference before I try to advertise the conference in the forums. A team that I have tried to build to A/A-/A+ has been a C- team or higher.

Ward use the low major DI to learn how to recruit and get u into a BCS conf, once u get there that's when you're gonna learn the most. It's hard to learn in a conf full of sims when u never get challenged, just work on getting to a BCS conf then the fun/hate will start.

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 4:38:00 PM (view original):

Posted by all2matt on 12/19/2016 4:17:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 2:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 2:41:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmax on 12/19/2016 2:31:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/19/2016 12:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmaniac2 on 12/19/2016 11:34:00 AM (view original):
It's a dying game as the results of their changes. I don't think it will make a difference even if they change it back or make improvements to fix the mistakes they made. Most people won't want to start their dynasty over.

Maybe they made changes because it was a dying game. That's my guess.

I agree that the game was in decline. I think WIS could have avoided the decline by making some efforts over the last 3-4 years to market the game.

BUT, the game clearly needed to be better suited to mobile devices

AND, the game clearly needed improvement.

I would have preferred significant marketing coupled with iterative more modest improvements, but without change the game was going no where.

In my opinion the game was severely underpopulated but I wouldn't call it dying. It all comes down to the marketing. The game could have done well as it was previously designed but people just didn't learn about it. I NEVER see a flash ad from whatifsports when I'm browsing the internet and I'm an actual user on the site which means that they clearly aren't marketing to people based on their cookies.

It doesn't really all come down to marketing. I knew about the game and had no interest. The game tilted heavily in favor of the "big" schools and, if you got there too late, your fate was set. If you were content to go 20-11 while 15-20 schools went 33-1 or 32-2 while rotating in the E8 you could play. If you hoped to get a shot at the F4, you had to hope a user died so you could get one of those schools.

And, FWIW, no one can scream "Realism!!!" and have coaches at the same school for 60-80 seasons. I'm sure term limits at schools would have went over really well.

For Mike and spud why don't you guys just win more? I took 2 different D+ BCS schools and turned them into A schools recently, I did it against these so called "I got here 1st" elite schools. It sounds more and more that you guys just suck at the game and don't want to take the time to learn it and get better. So u wanted seble to make it so u could compete but that still hasn't worked.

I guess if I were you too I would just win more, sounds pretty easy to me

Uh, this was my first season in 10 years. Maybe you should understand what you're talking about before you start posting.

And yet you post about HD like you Think your an 80 season vet? Maybe don't act you know it all if it's only your 1st season, maybe just listen to the vets that do know instead of arguing with them all the time. That's what I did for many many seasons, like reading every post Gillespie/billyG posted and learning what the ones that do know where willing to teach.

Maybe I'll just post as I see fit. I don't think I'm posting like an 80 season vet. I don't offer advice and I listen to anyone who'll answer when I ask a question. But all the whining and crying is just too much to ignore. I tried. And did it for about 3 weeks. Here's my resume from 10 years ago. Not good but not terrible either.

Earlham OWNED Wabash.

I got bored with the process. I could have stayed at VaTech but Duke/UNC had all the recruiting advantages and I just didn't feel like trying to chip away for another 2 years. 2 years playing an internet game is a long time. But, when I decided to quit, I didn't whine and cry non-stop for weeks. I just left.

Posted by kermit on 12/19/2016 4:52:00 PM (view original):
Earlham OWNED Wabash.

That's why I fled to Francis Marion. I guess.