Posted by fd343ny on 1/3/2017 12:43:00 PM (view original):
On the quick win notion - I would stay far away from those sorts of real competitive features in seeking quick wins. There is no free lunch and no quick win on those topics.

But, on less substantive stuff, I bet there are a lot of quick wins that could make users happier, the game a smidge better

I agree, when I'm talking "quick wins" i'm meaning things like, give me better sorting on the recriuting page. give me a comment box I can sort by (to label 1a 1b etc.)

longer term competitive balance ideas... those need to be tested with a large ranging user base, like an ongoing Beta. I think that's really a must have for any online game though. Those who really love the game would put enough time into it to make it worthwhile.

and Mike - I get what you're saying, there needs to be a good balance between divisions, that's not something that's lost in what I sent to WIS, I think adding coach input wouldn't change that at all.

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/3/2017 12:49:00 PM (view original):
I was simply pointing out the "user input" suggested is probably not going to be for a wide variety of users. I've already seen it. "You only have 7 seasons and no tourney wins. You don't know ****!!!" And while they may not know **** about how to win at HD, they can still understand how a change will affect the game for EVERYONE.

As for what I've suggested about transferring the EE problem to other users, it proves that the "EE is problem!!!" users aren't that concerned about users who don't have EE problems. Nothing more, nothing less. It's a very myopic view of EE.

There are more issues at top level D1 though Mike, it's just the nature of the game, more nuances that you don't deal with at the lower divisions. They need to be more thoughtfully figured out and refined. Again, WIS has a good vision imo but could benefit from a group of coaches who help them understand our frustrations and experiences and help relay that into a roadmap for how we'll make HD great again.

Posted by zhawks on 1/3/2017 1:01:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/3/2017 12:49:00 PM (view original):
I was simply pointing out the "user input" suggested is probably not going to be for a wide variety of users. I've already seen it. "You only have 7 seasons and no tourney wins. You don't know ****!!!" And while they may not know **** about how to win at HD, they can still understand how a change will affect the game for EVERYONE.

As for what I've suggested about transferring the EE problem to other users, it proves that the "EE is problem!!!" users aren't that concerned about users who don't have EE problems. Nothing more, nothing less. It's a very myopic view of EE.

There are more issues at top level D1 though Mike, it's just the nature of the game, more nuances that you don't deal with at the lower divisions. They need to be more thoughtfully figured out and refined. Again, WIS has a good vision imo but could benefit from a group of coaches who help them understand our frustrations and experiences and help relay that into a roadmap for how we'll make HD great again.

I have no EE problem. I have 1 D2 team and 2 D3 teams. I'm fine with transferring the "EE problem" to me. I recognize it's better for the game overall and I'm not selfish enough to disregard it.

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/3/2017 12:49:00 PM (view original):
I was simply pointing out the "user input" suggested is probably not going to be for a wide variety of users. I've already seen it. "You only have 7 seasons and no tourney wins. You don't know ****!!!" And while they may not know **** about how to win at HD, they can still understand how a change will affect the game for EVERYONE.

As for what I've suggested about transferring the EE problem to other users, it proves that the "EE is problem!!!" users aren't that concerned about users who don't have EE problems. Nothing more, nothing less. It's a very myopic view of EE.

Right on, Mike, exactly on point.

A suggestion is being floated that WIS form a small group of coaches to tell WIS what they would like. Sounds fine and reasonable ... until you realize that WIS already hears the widest possible input from all the discussion in the forums. Then the small group just sounds like a good ol' boy network. The same idea was floated during beta, and WIS wisely did not go that way.

Posted by zhawks on 1/3/2017 1:01:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/3/2017 12:49:00 PM (view original):
I was simply pointing out the "user input" suggested is probably not going to be for a wide variety of users. I've already seen it. "You only have 7 seasons and no tourney wins. You don't know ****!!!" And while they may not know **** about how to win at HD, they can still understand how a change will affect the game for EVERYONE.

As for what I've suggested about transferring the EE problem to other users, it proves that the "EE is problem!!!" users aren't that concerned about users who don't have EE problems. Nothing more, nothing less. It's a very myopic view of EE.

There are more issues at top level D1 though Mike, it's just the nature of the game, more nuances that you don't deal with at the lower divisions. They need to be more thoughtfully figured out and refined. Again, WIS has a good vision imo but could benefit from a group of coaches who help them understand our frustrations and experiences and help relay that into a roadmap for how we'll make HD great again.

D1 should be harder. D1 should present more obstacles and issues. That's the nature of life. Wanna be on top? Be prepared to fight to stay there because someone else wants that too.

Posted by CoachSpud on 1/3/2017 1:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/3/2017 12:49:00 PM (view original):
I was simply pointing out the "user input" suggested is probably not going to be for a wide variety of users. I've already seen it. "You only have 7 seasons and no tourney wins. You don't know ****!!!" And while they may not know **** about how to win at HD, they can still understand how a change will affect the game for EVERYONE.

As for what I've suggested about transferring the EE problem to other users, it proves that the "EE is problem!!!" users aren't that concerned about users who don't have EE problems. Nothing more, nothing less. It's a very myopic view of EE.

Right on, Mike, exactly on point.

A suggestion is being floated that WIS form a small group of coaches to tell WIS what they would like. Sounds fine and reasonable ... until you realize that WIS already hears the widest possible input from all the discussion in the forums. Then the small group just sounds like a good ol' boy network. The same idea was floated during beta, and WIS wisely did not go that way.

I think you're completely missing my point, but then again I'm not surprised. This isn't an idea to have a good ole boys club, I'd actually hate being a part of anything like that. It's merely to have a group that WIS could discuss with openly and help give the communities feedback. At the end of the day WIS is still going to do what WIS wants.

Actually IDK why I'm even responding to you.

No, I think I get your point. WIS already has the widest possible input in the forums. If it isn't a good ol' boys club and WIS already has the widest possible coaches' input, what benefit is a closed group going to be?

Actual input that doesn't get buried beneath thousands of words of ****?

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/3/2017 3:23:00 PM (view original):
Actual input that doesn't get buried beneath thousands of words of ****?

He's beyond help...

But yes - there's no reason for them to constantly monitor these forums based on how many people talk here. We as a community have **** on them for so long I don't blame them for losing site of the customers.

I recognize that.

I'd explain why we have elected officials to represent us as opposed to thousands of people piling into a stadium for an open forum with the POTUS but I'm sure it's beyond his comprehension.

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/3/2017 3:46:00 PM (view original):
I recognize that.

I'd explain why we have elected officials to represent us as opposed to thousands of people piling into a stadium for an open forum with the POTUS but I'm sure it's beyond his comprehension.

Fair point. If only Seble would have spent this much time on the forums when he worked on HD

it appears that WIS staff now and then glance at forums, or some threads on forums, but dont monitor them as closely as some customers.

I wouldn't look at any that reached 3 pages. They're off the rails by then.

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/3/2017 4:22:00 PM (view original):
I wouldn't look at any that reached 3 pages. They're off the rails by then.

We'd better lock this thread then.

You guys could be right. If they want customers' input, WIS might think that an insider's group might be better (for someone) than the widest possible input from the widest possible selection of all their customers. I could be wrong.