I've done individual scouting for internationals with my D3 team. Cost me $700 per level but I still chose to do it. I'm sure others have done the same.

The issue isn't that those with two id's in one world are cheating. We just don't know that they're NOT cheating, which is just as bad.

Posted by kevodaphenom on 4/3/2017 11:09:00 AM (view original):
The issue isn't that those with two id's in one world are cheating. We just don't know that they're NOT cheating, which is just as bad.

Well said.

Posted by zorzii on 4/3/2017 10:39:00 AM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 4/3/2017 10:33:00 AM (view original):

Posted by mamxet on 4/3/2017 9:53:00 AM (view original):
My take - I have no clue whether cheating took place.

I dont think it matters whether cheating took place - with the launch of 3.0, WIS should eliminate the ability to have two teams in a world under different names. The old 1000 mile rule was okay in prior game. It is not adequate in 3.0

They would have to make it functionally impossible, though, and that would include prohibiting multiple players in the same house (which is how I ended up with 2 IDs). That functional prohibition may be good for people's sense of fair play, but it would further hurt WIS's bottom line.

If I'm WIS, I think the best path forward is to require IDs used from the same IP address and/or credit card be linked and public. Have folks report questions of fair play violations. In this instance, it should be pretty easy to see, as long as they archive scouting/recruiting actions for more than just the current season. If the D1 scouted the player to L4, it's pretty damning. According to seble, policy is that beyond the 1000 mile rule, there is a "no-touching" rule, i.e. WIS would consider it a violation to go after a player that you scouted with a different team.

Shoe : This has nothing to do with this. The way the game is designed makes for cheating or at least for getting tempted. It needs to get rid of two IDS.

No, the moral obligation at question here is in no way on WIS. They aren't obligated to do anything.

The worst thing they can do is set a new ID restriction policy they can't or won't enforce, and rely on self-enforcement. That will stop very little actual cheating, because it will only affect the transparent players. That's not to say that transparent players never cheat - but I'm not nearly as worried about most of the guys I know about as I am about the guys I don't.

I totally get the fair play worry. When I first started, I was on that side (against multiple IDs) too. If they make it structurally impossible, I'll abide by it, and I won't complain. But I'm not interested in a soft ban they don't want to enforce. That's the worst of all worlds.

"but I'm not nearly as worried about most of the guys I know about as I am about the guys I don't."

I agree with this.

I've only been around for a couple years but maybe someone who has can shed some light on the history of cheating in HD. Did it happen more from users with well known multiple IDs or from people who had secret Alt IDs?

OK, stop the dumbassery.

Who "knows" anyone on this site? I've met a handful of users. But, as far as I know, the go home and beat their wives while being upstanding WifS' users. So, unless your lifelong friends or friendly neighbors with another user, knock off the "users I know" nonsense.

I mentored billysooner in HBD. Several questions per day. Nice fella. Looked after his teams when he went away on vacation. Dude got busted for multiple teams in the league I watched for him(he only gave me one password for one team).

The fact is D3 scouting money is scarce. You better be sure when you toss it at someone 2000+ miles away. What's the best way to be sure? Use scouting from a nearby team. Could be your alias or just a buddy you share info with. Of course, you probably "know" everyone well enough to know that people aren't sharing scouting info. No, no way that happens.

Posted by MikeT23 on 4/3/2017 12:02:00 PM (view original):
OK, stop the dumbassery.

Who "knows" anyone on this site? I've met a handful of users. But, as far as I know, the go home and beat their wives while being upstanding WifS' users. So, unless your lifelong friends or friendly neighbors with another user, knock off the "users I know" nonsense.

I mentored billysooner in HBD. Several questions per day. Nice fella. Looked after his teams when he went away on vacation. Dude got busted for multiple teams in the league I watched for him(he only gave me one password for one team).

The fact is D3 scouting money is scarce. You better be sure when you toss it at someone 2000+ miles away. What's the best way to be sure? Use scouting from a nearby team. Could be your alias or just a buddy you share info with. Of course, you probably "know" everyone well enough to know that people aren't sharing scouting info. No, no way that happens.

Not sure what this rambling post accomplished but that's not what shoe meant.

He just meant that you can know which IDs are from the same user. We all know shoe is also PK. Common knowledge. Less likely he's going to cheat with those IDs since he can get caught by other users.

not really much more to it than that.

Exchanging with you is a complete waste of time but I have a few minutes.

Numerous people have piped in with "I don't think 0nly cheated". My question to them would be "Based on what?" The evidence would suggest he did. He wasn't standing over a dead body with a bloody knife in his hands but he's in the same room wearing bloodstained clothes.

So the only reason one would say "I don't think he cheated" is because they "know" him. On the internet. Where nothing but truth spews.

Or maybe it's as a_in_the_b just said - "Accusation does not equal proof". You're 100% certain he cheated based upon what exactly?

And you're right, numerous people have 'piped in' (I guess that's an a-hole way of saying people offered their opinion) that they didn't think he cheated or they have no idea if he cheated or not. So I guess it's not only just me who thinks that way.

Btw- even the person who started this thread said he doesn't think he cheated.

Based on the first post:

About a day into recruiting a d3 school from the other side of the country (2000+ miles) shows up on the recruit. The problem: the D3 school is coached by a well known (not secret) second ID of a guy who as a D1 school close to my team.

I know turtl asked 0nly if he scouted Canada with his D1. Did 0nly say "No, I did not"? He could lie but, maybe, someone reports it and WifS sees that he did. Or maybe he didn't. But he hasn't said it.

People tend to be non-confrontational. No one wants to say "0nly is a filhty cheat" because they don't want to make waves. Me and my alias spud don't care. So we say it. It's just an odd "coincidence" that a D3 school goes 2000+ miles and either recruits blind or spends around 2k to scout a player when the user has an alias in the area. Very odd.

I'd hope that no one cares so much about HD success that they'd feel the need to cheat. But 0nly has demonstrated that it is important to him. I suspect he'd cheat. And there is evidence that he did.

MikeT, Simple question. Find the rule in the fair play guidelines where he cheated.

Simple question for you: Do you think you have to break a Fair Play guideline to cheat?

Posted by MikeT23 on 4/3/2017 1:09:00 PM (view original):
Simple question for you: Do you think you have to break a Fair Play guideline to cheat?

If the fair play guidelines are broken based on WIS policy, then yes it's cheating.

Now I would like for you to answer the question. Where in the fair play guidelines did only cheat? I'm not seeing anything.

OK, fair enough. WifS Fair Play Guidelines are outdated. That's on them. They're allowing it. Doesn't mean it's not cheating.

Example:
In HBD, there was a bug with International Free Agents. Once you saw one, you could add 1 to the end of his link to see the next one and the next one and the next one, etc. If the first was linked with HBDPIayer123456ifa, the next would be HBDPlayer123457ifa. Very few knew about it, I didn't, and it went unnoticed for years. Were those who used that to track the best IFA each year cheating? They could save their money because they knew better was on the way or if this one was the last good one. Were they cheating?

There is a rule in the fair play guidelines against sharing Future Stars Scouting information with multiple teams.

I would argue that any user who uses the D1 scouting service on the same state (or international) is in violation of this rule. Any scouting information that he learns at the D1 school would automatically be shared with and available to the D3 school because it's the same user. The only way to avoid breaking this rule is to not have any overlapping states.

Not accusing anyone of cheating, but I think this is a reasonable application of that rule. At minimum, WiS should clarify and update the guidelines for 3.0.