Posted by kcsundevil on 2/21/2020 8:10:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 2/21/2020 5:29:00 PM (view original):

Posted by kcsundevil on 2/21/2020 5:25:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 2/21/2020 5:18:00 PM (view original):

Posted by kcsundevil on 2/21/2020 5:01:00 PM (view original):
If the high-prestige jobs weren't recruited so badly by Sim, they'd never drop in prestige.

Yeah, the existing system may seem absurd in the short run, but it makes more and more humans eligible for those jobs over time until someone rakes them.

Jobs process has many flaws. This is not one of them.

Just make it easier to be eligible for a job so you don't NEED it to be a dumpster fire before being filled. I think that's his point

I used to agree with that, but dominant teams should not necessarily remain dominant when they change coaches.

B prestige UC doesnt seem dominant to me. Just a decent team.

We disagree.

Mully's complaint was about Cincy falling from a B+ perch. B+ prestige gets a pretty hefty recruiting advantage over most of the rest of D1.

In Tark, only 49 of the 324 teams are B+ prestige or above.

Or you could say 49 out of 120 user controlled teams. Which is much closer to average than dominant.

Posted by Benis on 2/21/2020 8:14:00 PM (view original):

Posted by kcsundevil on 2/21/2020 8:10:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 2/21/2020 5:29:00 PM (view original):

Posted by kcsundevil on 2/21/2020 5:25:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 2/21/2020 5:18:00 PM (view original):

Posted by kcsundevil on 2/21/2020 5:01:00 PM (view original):
If the high-prestige jobs weren't recruited so badly by Sim, they'd never drop in prestige.

Yeah, the existing system may seem absurd in the short run, but it makes more and more humans eligible for those jobs over time until someone rakes them.

Jobs process has many flaws. This is not one of them.

Just make it easier to be eligible for a job so you don't NEED it to be a dumpster fire before being filled. I think that's his point

I used to agree with that, but dominant teams should not necessarily remain dominant when they change coaches.

B prestige UC doesnt seem dominant to me. Just a decent team.

We disagree.

Mully's complaint was about Cincy falling from a B+ perch. B+ prestige gets a pretty hefty recruiting advantage over most of the rest of D1.

In Tark, only 49 of the 324 teams are B+ prestige or above.

Or you could say 49 out of 120 user controlled teams. Which is much closer to average than dominant.

Matter of perspective I guess. I'll point out not all 49 teams are human, 4 are currently in the Simmy Spiral.

And then there's Fresno, B+ for now but... yeah.

Posted by kcsundevil on 2/21/2020 8:26:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 2/21/2020 8:14:00 PM (view original):

Posted by kcsundevil on 2/21/2020 8:10:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 2/21/2020 5:29:00 PM (view original):

Posted by kcsundevil on 2/21/2020 5:25:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 2/21/2020 5:18:00 PM (view original):

Posted by kcsundevil on 2/21/2020 5:01:00 PM (view original):
If the high-prestige jobs weren't recruited so badly by Sim, they'd never drop in prestige.

Yeah, the existing system may seem absurd in the short run, but it makes more and more humans eligible for those jobs over time until someone rakes them.

Jobs process has many flaws. This is not one of them.

Just make it easier to be eligible for a job so you don't NEED it to be a dumpster fire before being filled. I think that's his point

I used to agree with that, but dominant teams should not necessarily remain dominant when they change coaches.

B prestige UC doesnt seem dominant to me. Just a decent team.

We disagree.

Mully's complaint was about Cincy falling from a B+ perch. B+ prestige gets a pretty hefty recruiting advantage over most of the rest of D1.

In Tark, only 49 of the 324 teams are B+ prestige or above.

Or you could say 49 out of 120 user controlled teams. Which is much closer to average than dominant.

Matter of perspective I guess. I'll point out not all 49 teams are human, 4 are currently in the Simmy Spiral.

And then there's Fresno, B+ for now but... yeah.

Haha yeah perhaps. My Utah team is B+ and I've won 1 NT game total the past 4 seasons, which I'd hardly call dominant.

If that’s your take on the OP KC then you REALLY dont get it. Most people would see there is some gap between maintaining a Bish prestige and going 0-54 in back to back season (which they will probably do) while sporting 6 Walkons. When HD makes it so bad that users don’t want to get into Big 6 conferences then they’ve done something wrong.

As a relatively new player, I see now why the leagues are so barren. It's incredibly frustrating dealing with the job system.

To offer perspective outside the top half of D1...

From Day 1, my buddy and I just wanted to jump into a mid major, compete with each other and build our programs. We're not looking to insta-jump into a Big 6. We've watched B and C rated programs flounder, have walk ons and disappear from relevance season after season as we built our resumes.

8 Years on, I still cannot get into the Horizon league. He fortunately had the option to jump into his desired team last season so I told him to jump. Knowing that it might take me another 3-50 seasons to get into the league.

The problem as I see it and that I think I'm reading in several of the posts here is that it's kind of an all or nothing system. You have to get to the post season, win in the post season and play the hardest schedules to move around. Without that you get stuck.

Prior to moving to D1, I'd won 17+ games a season for 5 seasons including accolades my 3 seasons at Western St. Being excited and not fully understanding the system, we both jumped to D1. I took over a 7 win Jacksonville st. team in order for us to stay in the same conference as Warak and I both had very limited options moving up to D1. (I get that we shouldn't jump to ACC, B10, etc. but 4-5 options seems ridiculous given our records at the time.)
My first year was worse than I imagined with only 9 wins, but I had some options to move end of season. Very limited mind you, but I had options.

Next I won 14, then 17. Obvious progress for a team that was really bad.

Yet both my past two seasons, i Have had literally ZERO D1 options. Not even a step back or lateral move. Even D- prestige schools are not interested. I'm sorry but not all D1 teams are looking for a coach who made a run in the NCAA tournament. Some are feeder schools or happy to get the next future coach. As it is now though, every school acts as if they are a Big 6 AD. It's incredibly frustrating.

I love this game, but my will to live in this sim is fading.... The system really kills any chances of movement and that's a bad thing.


Update: My first season finished at jacksonville st, the team had a D- prestige. I had options. My past two we are sitting at D and I have none. That seems backwards to me.

Stormfury, you’re not wrong. Of the dozen or so people I’ve personally invited to look at this game, none of them have stuck, and this is basically the common denominator. Too much time and money to get to the level they want to play.

Getting a mentor and/or actively reading through the forums is a good way to “uplevel” yourself, but requiring paying customers to jump through those kinds of hoops is very poor design.

Posted by Stormfury on 2/25/2020 8:56:00 AM (view original):
As a relatively new player, I see now why the leagues are so barren. It's incredibly frustrating dealing with the job system.

To offer perspective outside the top half of D1...

From Day 1, my buddy and I just wanted to jump into a mid major, compete with each other and build our programs. We're not looking to insta-jump into a Big 6. We've watched B and C rated programs flounder, have walk ons and disappear from relevance season after season as we built our resumes.

8 Years on, I still cannot get into the Horizon league. He fortunately had the option to jump into his desired team last season so I told him to jump. Knowing that it might take me another 3-50 seasons to get into the league.

The problem as I see it and that I think I'm reading in several of the posts here is that it's kind of an all or nothing system. You have to get to the post season, win in the post season and play the hardest schedules to move around. Without that you get stuck.

Prior to moving to D1, I'd won 17+ games a season for 5 seasons including accolades my 3 seasons at Western St. Being excited and not fully understanding the system, we both jumped to D1. I took over a 7 win Jacksonville st. team in order for us to stay in the same conference as Warak and I both had very limited options moving up to D1. (I get that we shouldn't jump to ACC, B10, etc. but 4-5 options seems ridiculous given our records at the time.)
My first year was worse than I imagined with only 9 wins, but I had some options to move end of season. Very limited mind you, but I had options.

Next I won 14, then 17. Obvious progress for a team that was really bad.

Yet both my past two seasons, i Have had literally ZERO D1 options. Not even a step back or lateral move. Even D- prestige schools are not interested. I'm sorry but not all D1 teams are looking for a coach who made a run in the NCAA tournament. Some are feeder schools or happy to get the next future coach. As it is now though, every school acts as if they are a Big 6 AD. It's incredibly frustrating.

I love this game, but my will to live in this sim is fading.... The system really kills any chances of movement and that's a bad thing.


Update: My first season finished at jacksonville st, the team had a D- prestige. I had options. My past two we are sitting at D and I have none. That seems backwards to me.

My suggestion is the same as usual. Play D2/D3!

I've stated my opinion here multiple times, but I feel each division is its own game. Who really cares what the name of the letterhead at the top of the screen says. If you enjoy HD but you're frustrated because you can't move where you want, try the lower levels! You can move anywhere you want. And you're still playing HD. Getting 17+ wins rewards you in some way. You're still competing with top coaches. A lot of coaches that play D1 also play D2 and D3. If you didn't spend enough time in D2 or D3 to figure how to win at an elite level, you're likely going to hate what happens to you when you get the big job opportunity anyways..... lose lose lose. I'm not speaking specifically to YOU. But to any coach that doesn't like the fact that they aren't eligible for jobs. Moving to D2 is much better than quitting. There's a ton of fun and strategy. Just a different style of strategy l.. And a ton of positive things HD has to offer, other than getting "Kentucky". Play D2 and get Kentucky State and put tape over the "State". Whatever you gotta do to be happy.

Sure D2 and D3 isn't for everybody. And neither is D1. But for coaches that aren't happy with D1...... there's the answer for you.

Posted by Benis on 2/25/2020 2:33:00 PM (view original):
Top, I love you man but this is terrible advice. It's like everyone telling you to play D1 when you don't want to. The OP doesn't want to play D2 or D3. If he did then he would be doing it already.

I don't disagree that the school name doesn't mean much in the big picture, but it is important to some people.

The OPs problem isn't with the D1 game itself, it's that getting to D1 takes too much time, money and effort. Unnecessarily.

1st paragraph.... no it's not. What WOULD be similar is if I continued to play D2 (as that's what I only play now), but I talked about how much I don't like D2 and that I don't think I'll be around much longer because of D2 itself. (Unrelated, there are reasons I've considered leaving. But it has nothing to do with me being unhappy with D2 while I continue to play it)

2nd paragraph... sure I can live with that

3rd paragraph.... ALL things D1, are considered part of the D1 experience.

My own add in..... my point was that HD isn't just D1. There's other areas to enjoy. From what I read, the OP enjoys HD. But is growing frustrated with the entirety of D1. That includes the things you mentioned. So I was just recommending that if a person loves HD but doesn't like the amount of time it takes to do whatever, don't quit! Try the other levels. It won't solve everyone's problems. It might not solve his. But it's an alternative

Seeing as you replied to my post, while I appreciate the "don't quit, play D2" advice, it's not what I signed up to play and not what I want to play. I'll stick it out a bit longer as i bought a 10 season pass. The point isn't change it or I quit, but rather the system is hella borked and explains why the leagues are so empty. Seems like that should be a priority for Whatif but obviously this game's not their big $ ticket item.

Posted by Stormfury on 2/25/2020 4:51:00 PM (view original):
Seeing as you replied to my post, while I appreciate the "don't quit, play D2" advice, it's not what I signed up to play and not what I want to play. I'll stick it out a bit longer as i bought a 10 season pass. The point isn't change it or I quit, but rather the system is hella borked and explains why the leagues are so empty. Seems like that should be a priority for Whatif but obviously this game's not their big $ ticket item.

Their is only one guy at the head it cost $10,000 per sale to hire people.

Posted by Stormfury on 2/25/2020 4:51:00 PM (view original):
Seeing as you replied to my post, while I appreciate the "don't quit, play D2" advice, it's not what I signed up to play and not what I want to play. I'll stick it out a bit longer as i bought a 10 season pass. The point isn't change it or I quit, but rather the system is hella borked and explains why the leagues are so empty. Seems like that should be a priority for Whatif but obviously this game's not their big $ ticket item.

Ahhhhh well then unfortunately benis is correct! I hate losing to that guy! Haha

I honestly got that impression from your post. I thought you were growing tired of it, and were going to quit. So if that's not the case, keep on making the trudge! But if that quitting point ever comes BECAUSE OF THESE ISSUES, give the lower levels a try first if you love the game.

Good luck with your mission!

Posted by topdogggbm on 2/25/2020 5:30:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Stormfury on 2/25/2020 4:51:00 PM (view original):
Seeing as you replied to my post, while I appreciate the "don't quit, play D2" advice, it's not what I signed up to play and not what I want to play. I'll stick it out a bit longer as i bought a 10 season pass. The point isn't change it or I quit, but rather the system is hella borked and explains why the leagues are so empty. Seems like that should be a priority for Whatif but obviously this game's not their big $ ticket item.

Ahhhhh well then unfortunately benis is correct! I hate losing to that guy! Haha

I honestly got that impression from your post. I thought you were growing tired of it, and were going to quit. So if that's not the case, keep on making the trudge! But if that quitting point ever comes BECAUSE OF THESE ISSUES, give the lower levels a try first if you love the game.

Good luck with your mission!

Ding ding ding!

Storm, one thing that sucks is that you would have been better off staying at d2 for a couple more seasons before jumping to d1. Taking a ****** d1 job actually sets you back unfortunately.

My advice would be to try to learn D1 recruiting "risk free" with this scrub team so you are ready for when you get your real job you are ready. Feel free to sitemail if you need any d1 tips.

Posted by topdogggbm on 2/25/2020 5:30:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Stormfury on 2/25/2020 4:51:00 PM (view original):
Seeing as you replied to my post, while I appreciate the "don't quit, play D2" advice, it's not what I signed up to play and not what I want to play. I'll stick it out a bit longer as i bought a 10 season pass. The point isn't change it or I quit, but rather the system is hella borked and explains why the leagues are so empty. Seems like that should be a priority for Whatif but obviously this game's not their big $ ticket item.

Ahhhhh well then unfortunately benis is correct! I hate losing to that guy! Haha

I honestly got that impression from your post. I thought you were growing tired of it, and were going to quit. So if that's not the case, keep on making the trudge! But if that quitting point ever comes BECAUSE OF THESE ISSUES, give the lower levels a try first if you love the game.

Good luck with your mission!

can i just ask for a moment... what you think he's been doing this whole time, if not giving the lower levels a try?

i am one who had and has no personal issue with the play-d3-first thing. however, i totally get where other people are coming from, and their frustration about the long slog to d1. its obvious. if you are reducing it to simply a name-of-school issue with a just-play-d2 solution, you need to seriously work on your empathy and/or open-mindedness (reducing the amount you let your personal bias blind you). (other folks reaching that conclusion may be screwed, because one can also reach that conclusion by being an idiot, and i'm not sure there is much they can work on in that case - but in your case that clearly isn't the problem!)