Posted by strikeout26 on 6/6/2020 1:35:00 PM (view original):
I have seen many people call for defunding the police force. The Minneapolis mayor mentioned the idea. It’s political pandering and is a terrible plan. Even reducing the budget makes no sense. Those guys already work in a very dangerous field for about $50k/year and despite the current battle cries are not racist or bad people.

We need to get our terms straight. Defunding would imply that the police budget doesn't exist. I haven't seen people in power call for this. Reducing the budget is something that I have seen. I won't dismiss the idea out of hand. I probably would need to see studies about it, and as many localities start to reduce the budget, we will see the effects soon. If it works, great. If it doesn't, I won't support it more in the future.

By the way, being a police officer isn't as dangerous as you might think.

And yes, the current system is broken. The protests prove that. Police have used force against peaceful protests repeatedly. That has to change. They get joy out of it.

I will concede that police shootings are probably one of the least broken parts of a broken criminal justice system.

A lower budget means less money for training and less money to pay police officers. I really, really, really hope that you can see how this can only end in one direction and that is poorly. Honestly, if you hear someone call for a reduced police budget I would recommend just assuming that anything they say henceforth is incredible. They have proven no ability to think critically.

Posted by tangplay on 6/6/2020 2:52:00 PM (view original):
By the way, being a police officer isn't as dangerous as you might think.

And yes, the current system is broken. The protests prove that. Police have used force against peaceful protests repeatedly. That has to change. They get joy out of it.

I will concede that police shootings are probably one of the least broken parts of a broken criminal justice system.

Please provide evidence that the system is broken. Also, please define what “broken” means to you. I think our definitions may vary. I take you to mean anything greater than zero is broken. Please correct as I don’t want to assume incorrectly.

By the way, Jeremiah Ellison (Keith Ellison’s son) called for completely dismantling and defunding the police force. He is on the Minneapolis city council. There is an example for you of people in a position of power calling for the defunding of the police force.

Posted by strikeout26 on 6/6/2020 2:20:00 PM (view original):
In 2019, 9 unarmed blacks were shot by police and 19 unarmed whites were. Police have 375M interactions with civilians/year. While we obviously want that to be zero, 28 out of 300,000,000 does not sound “broken” to me.

Also, the data axiomatically proves that systemic racism does not exist within the police force.

And whites are about 65% of the population and blacks are about 15%. Per capita numbers DO NOT support you young republican.

Posted by strikeout26 on 6/6/2020 3:01:00 PM (view original):
By the way, Jeremiah Ellison (Keith Ellison’s son) called for completely dismantling and defunding the police force. He is on the Minneapolis city council. There is an example for you of people in a position of power calling for the defunding of the police force.

I hear what you are saying but calling for something (which is playing to the mob and gets free publicity) and actually proposing legislation (or whatever the procedure is called at X level of government) are two different things.

Right now, it's simply a trial balloon to propagandize the citizenry. You see the same process after every mass shooting. Every activist on the planet calls for X gun control or ban, manipulated polls declare that 73.97% of the people (always a super-majority) want exactly what the activists are calling for and every politician who feels they can add a vote goes on the stump. Then, after a some time, broader public opinion is actually measured to see if the propaganda worked...usually resulting in too little a change in public opinion to effect a change. The balloon goes back into storage until the next time.

Rinse and repeat.

Posted by strikeout26 on 6/6/2020 2:55:00 PM (view original):
A lower budget means less money for training and less money to pay police officers. I really, really, really hope that you can see how this can only end in one direction and that is poorly. Honestly, if you hear someone call for a reduced police budget I would recommend just assuming that anything they say henceforth is incredible. They have proven no ability to think critically.

I don't dismiss many ideas out of hand. We'll see if it works. You may very well be right. You could also be wrong.

Posted by strikeout26 on 6/6/2020 2:57:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tangplay on 6/6/2020 2:52:00 PM (view original):
By the way, being a police officer isn't as dangerous as you might think.

And yes, the current system is broken. The protests prove that. Police have used force against peaceful protests repeatedly. That has to change. They get joy out of it.

I will concede that police shootings are probably one of the least broken parts of a broken criminal justice system.

Please provide evidence that the system is broken. Also, please define what “broken” means to you. I think our definitions may vary. I take you to mean anything greater than zero is broken. Please correct as I don’t want to assume incorrectly.

Yep. When we have a system designed to be held accountable by the people, meant to serve the people, every wrong action by said institution is a major wrong. The fact that we see similar situations repeating around the country only proves my point further.

If I were dictator-king, and could address only 5 to 10 problems in America, policing might not make the list. But police brutality is a problem with solutions, some of which we already agreed on.

My major philosophy on this is that we have one party who may be slightly reactionary to the problem and offer a wide variety of solutions, some great, some not; and we have another party who is choosing to deny that a problem exists at all. I'm always going to support the people who at least acknowledge the problem exists to begin with.

Here I'm speaking of not only policing, but criminal justice and a wide variety of other issues.

Posted by tangplay on 6/6/2020 2:52:00 PM (view original):
By the way, being a police officer isn't as dangerous as you might think.

And yes, the current system is broken. The protests prove that. Police have used force against peaceful protests repeatedly. That has to change. They get joy out of it.

I will concede that police shootings are probably one of the least broken parts of a broken criminal justice system.

how do you know how dangerous being a police officer is? Also, how do you know how dangerous we think it is? I'm pretty sure it is more dangerous than being a stockbroker or a IT person.

12.6 police die per 100 thousand. It's nowhere close to being one of the most dangerous jobs in America.

Posted by tangplay on 6/6/2020 4:30:00 PM (view original):

Posted by strikeout26 on 6/6/2020 2:55:00 PM (view original):
A lower budget means less money for training and less money to pay police officers. I really, really, really hope that you can see how this can only end in one direction and that is poorly. Honestly, if you hear someone call for a reduced police budget I would recommend just assuming that anything they say henceforth is incredible. They have proven no ability to think critically.

I don't dismiss many ideas out of hand. We'll see if it works. You may very well be right. You could also be wrong.

Nope. This is clearly a dangerous idea. It’s best to just “dismiss this out of hand.” You can’t be for more training and a lower budget. It just doesn’t work.