Savage II Commentary Thread Topic

Posted by jhsukow on 8/6/2020 1:38:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bds9992 on 8/6/2020 1:33:00 PM (view original):
Yeah, guys, c'mon. This is petty, don't you think? Chill.
...no.
https://youtu.be/m4ZBT3BWaj4?t=45
8/6/2020 1:47 PM
I'm on deck right now and have refreshed the draft page like 50 times ready to post one of my two guys, both of whom I'm happy with, so I can beat robusk!
8/6/2020 1:48 PM
Posted by jcred5 on 8/6/2020 1:48:00 PM (view original):
I'm on deck right now and have refreshed the draft page like 50 times ready to post one of my two guys, both of whom I'm happy with, so I can beat robusk!
This is the savage fun I have missed.
8/6/2020 1:54 PM
Posted by jcred5 on 8/6/2020 1:48:00 PM (view original):
I'm on deck right now and have refreshed the draft page like 50 times ready to post one of my two guys, both of whom I'm happy with, so I can beat robusk!
lets all just take a deep breath....
slow down ...

you dont want to make some of the same eager mistakes I've made in life....
like my high school sweetheart use to always say:
"is THAT it?"


8/6/2020 2:01 PM
Posted by dBKC on 8/6/2020 1:37:00 PM (view original):
Right but that’s why I think a good compromise would be “if new players drop by 8/21, regardless of when the draft ends, then you can use them” - because then you still get the effect but without anyone potentially purposefully stalling since it wouldn’t matter with something like that in place.
I understand your point. Someone threw out the 16th (maybe in jest) and that seemed a very aggressive time line at least for the drafts I have been a part of here.

8/6/2020 2:02 PM
Posted by pharrop on 8/6/2020 12:24:00 PM (view original):
To change the decision now on 19-20 players seems unfair. Before I made my pick, I scanned through the threads to find the statement that we will use 19-20 seasons if they come out before the draft ends.

it is on page 1 of the rules. Now people want to change it?

I agree it would be unfair to now declare we aren't using them. I want to use them. Which is why I would prefer that we just say we're going to use them and the league won't start until they come out. Which will be little, if any, delay. What I think is counterproductive is creating a scenario where some people have serious incentive to drag the league out as long as possible because it will have a real benefit to their team. Not to mention the general concept of a draft where we don't even know what the player pool is until it's over (or at least until the very end). We're basically telling everyone to gamble on something entirely out of our control (when WIS releases the new players; and to some extent what the seasons look like - i.e., defensive ratings, which won't be finalized until all-defensive teams are announced, what position eligibility will be, and how WIS chooses to apply the pro-rating effect.

Take Giannis for example. If we're in the 10th round and have no player seasons yet, his owner doesn't know whether he needs a backup to his amazing, high-usage 19-20 season or something entirely different. He doesn't know which positions his new season will be 100% at. He doesn't know what the D rating will be (and good luck predicting that). He doesn't even know how many minutes the season will have in the database. How are you supposed to draft for that at the end of the draft? We can't use anyone outside the 12 guys we pick, so you're looking at potentially having to burn 2 draft picks, 1/6 of your draft, to cover for two drastically different possibilities, one of which has a variety of other minor different possibilities built in. '

It's just a crazy amount of uncertainty. If we just say now that we're using the seasons, the only uncertainty is whether the league starts immediately after the draft or we wait a few days. But who cares? It will take a few days for everyone to get their teams in anyway. If we have to choose between uncertainty between when the league starts and uncertainty about who is in the player pool, I'll choose the former every time.
8/6/2020 2:15 PM
in that case the safest thing is not to use the new seasons so the variables go away and you draft what's known.

the savage thing to do would be to include the new seasons so there was some uncertainty as to what the new season would look like, but at least you know you'd get to use them.

but what to do when WIS doesn't update the player database until late Sept... complain? You're making decisions based on optimism when it comes to WIS? You can't make managerial decisions that include dependencies on unreliable assets. You set yourself up for failure.
8/6/2020 2:31 PM (edited)
If we’re really going to count average time from previous draft slot, just promise me no one will go on a rant about the Freddie Kruger effect or liberal insanity
8/6/2020 2:26 PM
You guys are really going to make me scrape BBR and engineer the WiS stats for this gd draft, aren't you?
8/6/2020 2:30 PM
Posted by robusk on 8/6/2020 2:30:00 PM (view original):
You guys are really going to make me scrape BBR and engineer the WiS stats for this gd draft, aren't you?
I don't know what in the hel! that means... but it sounds bad

go ahead and do it
8/6/2020 2:34 PM
Posted by pexetera on 8/6/2020 2:31:00 PM (view original):
in that case the safest thing is not to use the new seasons so the variables go away and you draft what's known.

the savage thing to do would be to include the new seasons so there was some uncertainty as to what the new season would look like, but at least you know you'd get to use them.

but what to do when WIS doesn't update the player database until late Sept... complain? You're making decisions based on optimism when it comes to WIS? You can't make managerial decisions that include dependencies on unreliable assets. You set yourself up for failure.
The first point is fair. We'd have to pause the draft until new player seasons are in to have all the uncertainty solved.

As to timing of the release - WIS does nothing for the bball SIM except upload new player seasons. They don't give a crap about this SIM but I cannot remember a time in the last few years where they didn't put in the new player seasons relatively promptly. Maybe I'm forgetting a time that others might remember.
8/6/2020 2:38 PM
Posted by tarheel1991 on 8/6/2020 2:38:00 PM (view original):
Posted by pexetera on 8/6/2020 2:31:00 PM (view original):
in that case the safest thing is not to use the new seasons so the variables go away and you draft what's known.

the savage thing to do would be to include the new seasons so there was some uncertainty as to what the new season would look like, but at least you know you'd get to use them.

but what to do when WIS doesn't update the player database until late Sept... complain? You're making decisions based on optimism when it comes to WIS? You can't make managerial decisions that include dependencies on unreliable assets. You set yourself up for failure.
The first point is fair. We'd have to pause the draft until new player seasons are in to have all the uncertainty solved.

As to timing of the release - WIS does nothing for the bball SIM except upload new player seasons. They don't give a crap about this SIM but I cannot remember a time in the last few years where they didn't put in the new player seasons relatively promptly. Maybe I'm forgetting a time that others might remember.
2017-18 took like 10 months to come out as they changed data providers. There was only like one ODL between 17-18 release and 18-19 release.
8/6/2020 2:40 PM
Posted by robusk on 8/6/2020 2:30:00 PM (view original):
You guys are really going to make me scrape BBR and engineer the WiS stats for this gd draft, aren't you?
MF'er.... when did they make the play index subscription only??????!!!!!
8/6/2020 2:45 PM
Posted by robusk on 8/6/2020 2:45:00 PM (view original):
Posted by robusk on 8/6/2020 2:30:00 PM (view original):
You guys are really going to make me scrape BBR and engineer the WiS stats for this gd draft, aren't you?
MF'er.... when did they make the play index subscription only??????!!!!!
Okay, if you navigate to it via the link on the homepage it redirects you to a subscription service. However, if you get to it by the duckduckgo result page on "basketball reference play index" it still takes you to the free page.

What a pain in the *** that only like one or two other people will care about.
8/6/2020 2:47 PM
Posted by robusk on 8/6/2020 2:40:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tarheel1991 on 8/6/2020 2:38:00 PM (view original):
Posted by pexetera on 8/6/2020 2:31:00 PM (view original):
in that case the safest thing is not to use the new seasons so the variables go away and you draft what's known.

the savage thing to do would be to include the new seasons so there was some uncertainty as to what the new season would look like, but at least you know you'd get to use them.

but what to do when WIS doesn't update the player database until late Sept... complain? You're making decisions based on optimism when it comes to WIS? You can't make managerial decisions that include dependencies on unreliable assets. You set yourself up for failure.
The first point is fair. We'd have to pause the draft until new player seasons are in to have all the uncertainty solved.

As to timing of the release - WIS does nothing for the bball SIM except upload new player seasons. They don't give a crap about this SIM but I cannot remember a time in the last few years where they didn't put in the new player seasons relatively promptly. Maybe I'm forgetting a time that others might remember.
2017-18 took like 10 months to come out as they changed data providers. There was only like one ODL between 17-18 release and 18-19 release.
Well then, I stand corrected
8/6/2020 3:05 PM
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