Posted by bruceleefan on 4/28/2021 12:18:00 PM (view original):
Seems absurd to have to even mention this in this discussion but based on many responses it definitely is warranted.

"Jewish" is both a religion AND an ethnicity.
Sammy Davis Jr. was Jewish but not Jewish.

The persecution of the Jews comes from those who are opposed to the ethnicity and not the religion.

Yes they are intimately linked, but they are also two entirely differently things.

True, actually. I have probably been conflating the two too much in this conversation. To be clear, I am ethnically Jewish, not religiously Jewish. My great grandmother escaped the Holocaust by fleeing Hungary.

But then the idea of it being a "Jewish state" is even worse because you're talking about preserving an ethnic majority, which is the dictionary definition of an ethnostate.

Posted by tangplay on 4/28/2021 12:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bruceleefan on 4/28/2021 12:18:00 PM (view original):
Seems absurd to have to even mention this in this discussion but based on many responses it definitely is warranted.

"Jewish" is both a religion AND an ethnicity.
Sammy Davis Jr. was Jewish but not Jewish.

The persecution of the Jews comes from those who are opposed to the ethnicity and not the religion.

Yes they are intimately linked, but they are also two entirely differently things.

True, actually. I have probably been conflating the two too much in this conversation. To be clear, I am ethnically Jewish, not religiously Jewish. My great grandmother escaped the Holocaust by fleeing Hungary.

But then the idea of it being a "Jewish state" is even worse because you're talking about preserving an ethnic majority, which is the dictionary definition of an ethnostate.

Omg. You are not part of the Jewish people.
you are not Jewish if you accept Jesus as God.
you only have Jewish ancestry.
if you have Jewish ancestry and are atheist but don’t accept false gods but consider your a part of the Jewish people and consider Israel your eternal homeland even with some disagreements then you are Jewish.
you - my friend are not Jewish even if you eat a bagel once in a while.
you have abandoned the Jewish people.
and you don’t even want to say what you believe.
I thought you were Lutheran.

He told me he was a Mennonite.

Posted by dino27 on 4/28/2021 12:24:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bruceleefan on 4/28/2021 12:18:00 PM (view original):
Seems absurd to have to even mention this in this discussion but based on many responses it definitely is warranted.

"Jewish" is both a religion AND an ethnicity.
Sammy Davis Jr. was Jewish but not Jewish.

The persecution of the Jews comes from those who are opposed to the ethnicity and not the religion.

Yes they are intimately linked, but they are also two entirely differently things.

This man really does understand.
there are millions upon millions of secular Jews who don’t even believe in the Bible except as a source of inspiration and heritage.

I would say the Arab hate is based on ethnicity but there is plenty of hate based on refusal to accept Jesus.

In fact, the animosity goes all the way back to Abraham and his two sons from different mothers. Ishmael and his mother were sent away by Abraham, because they were plotting against Isaac.

And you are such a purveyor of bullshit slogans and organize your thoughts around a favorite word like ethnostate and then reverse engineer.

Posted by DougOut on 4/28/2021 12:40:00 PM (view original):
He told me he was a Mennonite.

That’s what it was.
I knew it was something like that.

Posted by bruceleefan on 4/28/2021 12:41:00 PM (view original):

Posted by dino27 on 4/28/2021 12:24:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bruceleefan on 4/28/2021 12:18:00 PM (view original):
Seems absurd to have to even mention this in this discussion but based on many responses it definitely is warranted.

"Jewish" is both a religion AND an ethnicity.
Sammy Davis Jr. was Jewish but not Jewish.

The persecution of the Jews comes from those who are opposed to the ethnicity and not the religion.

Yes they are intimately linked, but they are also two entirely differently things.

This man really does understand.
there are millions upon millions of secular Jews who don’t even believe in the Bible except as a source of inspiration and heritage.

I would say the Arab hate is based on ethnicity but there is plenty of hate based on refusal to accept Jesus.

In fact, the animosity goes all the way back to Abraham and his two sons from different mothers. Ishmael and his mother were sent away by Abraham, because they were plotting against Isaac.

It goes back pretty far.

Posted by tangplay on 4/28/2021 12:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bruceleefan on 4/28/2021 12:18:00 PM (view original):
Seems absurd to have to even mention this in this discussion but based on many responses it definitely is warranted.

"Jewish" is both a religion AND an ethnicity.
Sammy Davis Jr. was Jewish but not Jewish.

The persecution of the Jews comes from those who are opposed to the ethnicity and not the religion.

Yes they are intimately linked, but they are also two entirely differently things.

True, actually. I have probably been conflating the two too much in this conversation. To be clear, I am ethnically Jewish, not religiously Jewish. My great grandmother escaped the Holocaust by fleeing Hungary.

But then the idea of it being a "Jewish state" is even worse because you're talking about preserving an ethnic majority, which is the dictionary definition of an ethnostate.

You will never be one of us.
dream on.

I hereby call a truce with Doug and Bruce and Guitarguy.
this is so important to me and I will keep the truce with you guys......completely.
Tangplay should expect plenty of more minus 1 in the future and he is a bad thinker.

Posted by laramiebob on 4/28/2021 11:36:00 AM (view original):
IF it's a Jewish State then I've gotta conclude other "belief" structures are "minorities", no? I admit I'm ignorant as to the verbiage of the Israeli Constitution but I do know OURS and ours has specific language to try and prohibit a "National" religion. Thus, legally, we are NOT a Christian Nation. We've eliminated that argument from our system legally......... no more fights over WHO is Christian and who ain't. (Ask any Mormon!).

Do they have legal Constitutional protections for the Hare Krishna(s) (or whoever) in Israel?
And IF they do, it's NOT a Jewish State.

well, it does say "in God we trust" on our money. Seems like a weird thing to put on your money if you are a non-religious nation.

Posted by dino27 on 4/28/2021 12:39:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tangplay on 4/28/2021 12:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bruceleefan on 4/28/2021 12:18:00 PM (view original):
Seems absurd to have to even mention this in this discussion but based on many responses it definitely is warranted.

"Jewish" is both a religion AND an ethnicity.
Sammy Davis Jr. was Jewish but not Jewish.

The persecution of the Jews comes from those who are opposed to the ethnicity and not the religion.

Yes they are intimately linked, but they are also two entirely differently things.

True, actually. I have probably been conflating the two too much in this conversation. To be clear, I am ethnically Jewish, not religiously Jewish. My great grandmother escaped the Holocaust by fleeing Hungary.

But then the idea of it being a "Jewish state" is even worse because you're talking about preserving an ethnic majority, which is the dictionary definition of an ethnostate.

Omg. You are not part of the Jewish people.
you are not Jewish if you accept Jesus as God.
you only have Jewish ancestry.
if you have Jewish ancestry and are atheist but don’t accept false gods but consider your a part of the Jewish people and consider Israel your eternal homeland even with some disagreements then you are Jewish.
you - my friend are not Jewish even if you eat a bagel once in a while.
you have abandoned the Jewish people.
and you don’t even want to say what you believe.
I thought you were Lutheran.

Dino, I don't think you (or anyone else) have the right to tell tang what he is or isn't. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but how one identifies oneself is his/her/their business.

Posted by wylie715 on 4/28/2021 12:48:00 PM (view original):

Posted by laramiebob on 4/28/2021 11:36:00 AM (view original):
IF it's a Jewish State then I've gotta conclude other "belief" structures are "minorities", no? I admit I'm ignorant as to the verbiage of the Israeli Constitution but I do know OURS and ours has specific language to try and prohibit a "National" religion. Thus, legally, we are NOT a Christian Nation. We've eliminated that argument from our system legally......... no more fights over WHO is Christian and who ain't. (Ask any Mormon!).

Do they have legal Constitutional protections for the Hare Krishna(s) (or whoever) in Israel?
And IF they do, it's NOT a Jewish State.

well, it does say "in God we trust" on our money. Seems like a weird thing to put on your money if you are a non-religious nation.

That’s right. All you have to do is think of Israel as a reservation that has non Jews living there with constitutional rights and representation.
and if they don’t like living in a Jewish state and it offends them then they have the entire rest of the world to go to.

Posted by wylie715 on 4/28/2021 12:53:00 PM (view original):

Posted by dino27 on 4/28/2021 12:39:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tangplay on 4/28/2021 12:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bruceleefan on 4/28/2021 12:18:00 PM (view original):
Seems absurd to have to even mention this in this discussion but based on many responses it definitely is warranted.

"Jewish" is both a religion AND an ethnicity.
Sammy Davis Jr. was Jewish but not Jewish.

The persecution of the Jews comes from those who are opposed to the ethnicity and not the religion.

Yes they are intimately linked, but they are also two entirely differently things.

True, actually. I have probably been conflating the two too much in this conversation. To be clear, I am ethnically Jewish, not religiously Jewish. My great grandmother escaped the Holocaust by fleeing Hungary.

But then the idea of it being a "Jewish state" is even worse because you're talking about preserving an ethnic majority, which is the dictionary definition of an ethnostate.

Omg. You are not part of the Jewish people.
you are not Jewish if you accept Jesus as God.
you only have Jewish ancestry.
if you have Jewish ancestry and are atheist but don’t accept false gods but consider your a part of the Jewish people and consider Israel your eternal homeland even with some disagreements then you are Jewish.
you - my friend are not Jewish even if you eat a bagel once in a while.
you have abandoned the Jewish people.
and you don’t even want to say what you believe.
I thought you were Lutheran.

Dino, I don't think you (or anyone else) have the right to tell tang what he is or isn't. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but how one identifies oneself is his/her/their business.

He has every right to be deluded but he is not Jewish by Jewish law or by prevailing Jewish standards.
he can call himself green.
if he thinks it that is his business .
he can call himself Jewish and I can call myself Korean but I’m not Korean.

My point is that he and so called messianic Jews can call themselves Jews but Jews do not accept them as Jews. Just posers.

and that is part of the way we understand surviving.

Posted by dino27 on 4/28/2021 12:50:00 PM (view original):
I hereby call a truce with Doug and Bruce and Guitarguy.
this is so important to me and I will keep the truce with you guys......completely.
Tangplay should expect plenty of more minus 1 in the future and he is a bad thinker.

You admit that you start from the position of disliking someone and develop your opinions from there?