I have 4 basic recruiting questions where I am still not sure of the answers after searching forum. Thanks in advance for any answers.

Yellow, green, red preferences (question does not include playing time preference). Does a green preference give an advantage over yellow? Are red and green equal in effect such that a red will cancel a green i.e. if you have 2 red and 2 green is that the same as 1 red and 1 green or is there an advantage with 2 green with 2 red?

Early, Eo1, whenever (for question assume very high with scholarship offered and no other teams above very low). Is there any preference when a “whenever” will sign or is it just 50% early and 50% late and can this be influenced? Does adding additional AP increase the likelihood of Early, Eo1 or whenever signing on an earlier recruiting cycle i.e. if “early “ preference and signing is open and no other teams contesting will the additional AP influence the signing time or will the team continue to wait until some predetermined time in the early cycle to sign?

Disregarding poaching strategy or playing time bonus, does it matter when HV or CV are offered to a recruit? Is there any cumulative advantage to offering them early besides the 5 CV limit?

Does offering 15 minutes vs 10 minutes playing time increase any AP modifiers?

Also, one potential question with which I’m not sure. Does time affect a change from blue to black? When taking over my team there was a junior and senior still having blue potential. As an example, if a freshman has 50 blue and the same player as a sophomore has 50 blue is the sophomore more likely to turn black sooner?

A lot of preferences have a range within the color/designation. For example, a very good for distance of 10 miles is worth more than a very good for distance at 100 miles. So very goods don't necessarily balance out very bads. Also different preferences are weighted different. A very good on distance doesn't give the exact same benefit as play style for example.

Whenever is supposed to be 50% sign in first session but I'm skeptical of that. You can't influence signing by putting in more effort.

Outside of playing time, no benefit to offering HVs earlier.

15 min gives a stronger preference modifier than 10 min if they want to play.

class/age has no impact on potentials.

Posted by vinzander on 2/10/2022 2:40:00 PM (view original):
I have 4 basic recruiting questions where I am still not sure of the answers after searching forum. Thanks in advance for any answers.

Yellow, green, red preferences (question does not include playing time preference). Does a green preference give an advantage over yellow? Are red and green equal in effect such that a red will cancel a green i.e. if you have 2 red and 2 green is that the same as 1 red and 1 green or is there an advantage with 2 green with 2 red?

Early, Eo1, whenever (for question assume very high with scholarship offered and no other teams above very low). Is there any preference when a “whenever” will sign or is it just 50% early and 50% late and can this be influenced? Does adding additional AP increase the likelihood of Early, Eo1 or whenever signing on an earlier recruiting cycle i.e. if “early “ preference and signing is open and no other teams contesting will the additional AP influence the signing time or will the team continue to wait until some predetermined time in the early cycle to sign?

Disregarding poaching strategy or playing time bonus, does it matter when HV or CV are offered to a recruit? Is there any cumulative advantage to offering them early besides the 5 CV limit?

Does offering 15 minutes vs 10 minutes playing time increase any AP modifiers?

Also, one potential question with which I’m not sure. Does time affect a change from blue to black? When taking over my team there was a junior and senior still having blue potential. As an example, if a freshman has 50 blue and the same player as a sophomore has 50 blue is the sophomore more likely to turn black sooner?

1.) Every preference is weighed on a scale within each category (including very high for playing time), such that 5 miles away is better than 195 miles away, though both show up as a green “very good” in the preference view. How much better is a matter of interpretation, but it’s definitely better. And yes, you definitely get recruiting advantages for matching up with a player’s preference. It’s not really great to think of it like canceling out, because it’s always relative to the other human coaches going after the guy. If you’re a D3 school going after a low level D1 pool player who wants success, you’re not likely going to get very good there. You may be at neutral or even worse. That’s alright as long as your competition is other D3 schools who won’t likely be able to get the preference match, either.

2. Along with the tendency (early, EOP1, etc) that we can see, players also have some hidden probability figure denoting when that comes up. Now WIS has never explicitly said how it works, but it’s one of two things. Either players have a programmed cycle where they are going to sign (which means it’s not really probability at all, of course, it just looks like it to us), and then they always sign after that if they have a qualified offer on the table; OR players have a % chance to sign every cycle, starting based on when their tendency suggests, with increasing odds as they progress, such that early players reach 100% by like the 7th cycle, EOP1 by the 10th.

For whenever guys, It’s not exactly 50%, even though there are 10 signing cycles in both Recruiting Sessions; it’s better to think of it like the player’s signing cycle can come up anywhere from 1 to 20. Well probably not 20, more like 1 to 16, I think they’re all programmed to definitely be signing by #16, when D3 schools can start signing D1 pool players. And since the variation is dispersed 1 to 16 instead of 1 to 20, you’ll see more whenever guys going in the RS1.

3. Regarding if there is strategic advantage to timing of effort outside of sniping or the playing time preference players: Nope, none at all outside those two important considerations.

4. For players with the playing time preference, yes it does, fairly significantly, but not as much as 20 or 25 minutes. For players without the preference, there is only the one-time boost, which is also significant, but does not affect other cumulative effort.

5. All player attribute potentials have ceilings, and they don’t change. A blue 50 for a player as a freshman and sophomore means they just didn’t grow. Either the last coach didn’t prioritize that attribute in the practice plan, or perhaps the players slipped back in the off-season (this happens a lot with lower work ethic players, and all players can drop stamina over the offseason, which is nonsense, but whatever).

fantastic answers by shoe. re: #5 - any time you see 'max ratings' referenced on the board, this is what we are talking about. the max ratings are fixed at the time recruits are generated. 'potential' gives us a range of what their max rating can be, so we have imperfect information - but the max rating value is fixed before we get involved, and we have no influence over it.

you can actually figure out the exact max rating (or perhaps within 1, sometimes rounding makes this tricky to get 100% exact), if you watch for the first color change. for example, a low blue is +21, a high black is +20, so if your guy with 50 blue turns black when he hits 52, he's got a 72 cap and so forth.

Thanks for all the great answers. Appreciated.

The only other thing depending on the question for #5 and circumstances is ratings do have decimals but we do not see them. So a player may have 50 Blue DEF end of the season and start the next season 50 black. He increased in between seasons, but by a decimal. That just happened to also be his next step down in potentials. I've had it happen with recruits that come in.

Posted by bagger288 on 2/11/2022 8:28:00 AM (view original):
The only other thing depending on the question for #5 and circumstances is ratings do have decimals but we do not see them. So a player may have 50 Blue DEF end of the season and start the next season 50 black. He increased in between seasons, but by a decimal. That just happened to also be his next step down in potentials. I've had it happen with recruits that come in.

I feel like this happens every season to me and I understand why it happens but it still slightly drives me insane and makes me feel like I got cheated a point (or more on a green).

To add to 3: There very much is a strategic advantage in the timing of your efforts mainly in terms of perception, are you trying to scare away other coaches? Go hard early. Are you trying to knock off over-division Sims? Do only as much as necessary. Want to see if the rival coach is going to get involved in other battles? Hold off until he/she thinks you've given up. Rarely is predictably putting all your efforts in from the get-go the right decision. Avoid being predictable.

Posted by bpielcmc on 2/11/2022 12:17:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bagger288 on 2/11/2022 8:28:00 AM (view original):
The only other thing depending on the question for #5 and circumstances is ratings do have decimals but we do not see them. So a player may have 50 Blue DEF end of the season and start the next season 50 black. He increased in between seasons, but by a decimal. That just happened to also be his next step down in potentials. I've had it happen with recruits that come in.

I feel like this happens every season to me and I understand why it happens but it still slightly drives me insane and makes me feel like I got cheated a point (or more on a green).

To add to 3: There very much is a strategic advantage in the timing of your efforts mainly in terms of perception, are you trying to scare away other coaches? Go hard early. Are you trying to knock off over-division Sims? Do only as much as necessary. Want to see if the rival coach is going to get involved in other battles? Hold off until he/she thinks you've given up. Rarely is predictably putting all your efforts in from the get-go the right decision. Avoid being predictable.

Yeah there are all sorts of game theory strategic implications of the timing of effort, which I sort of encapsulated in “sniping”, and I suppose that’s misleading if those aren’t obvious to you. What I mean is that there is no effort credit consideration there - no extra “considering credit” accrued for being in the lead, that sort of thing. The only modifier that affects the *real value* of effort as regards its timing is the playing time promise for players with that preference.

" Are you trying to knock off over-division Sims? Do only as much as necessary."

Is this "low" or "very low" or do you mean something else for "as necessary"?

I agree with all the answers given on timing of effort, but want to add that the tactics of timing are very situation specfic. Is this a player where you have some built in advantages and want to deter other contestants? or is this a player you can afford to pursue ONLY if you get lucky on another guy? or, do you need two guys at a position and have one guy you can lock up cheap - and therefore decide to try to go for a reach.....and who else is on the player - is a superior opponent looking active?

all this is to say that some of the game is calculation of plusses and minuses but some of it is reading the competitive terrain in a dynamic way - but you knew that!

Posted by vinzander on 2/13/2022 4:26:00 PM (view original):
" Are you trying to knock off over-division Sims? Do only as much as necessary."

Is this "low" or "very low" or do you mean something else for "as necessary"?

This is very low. Sims are believed to stop putting effort in a guy if their initial effort either keeps them at or they are knocked back to a threshold that exists within very low. Anything besides very low calls for concern/response and even then very low does not mean 100% safe.