League#: (Will send via sitemail upon signup)

I am going to be starting the next league under the TWISL (Testing What If Sports League) brand, diving into defense and pitcher value.

As many may may have seen with the recent discussions on dynamic pricing, the topic of value of deadball and modern pitchers, especially as it relates to defense has been frequently argued and cited. I have a clear opinion on the matter, but let's put it to the test.

GOALS: Here are the things I'd like this league to be able to contribute to:

• Increase our understanding of pitcher value - specifically as defense effects overall performance: but more importantly we will look at stats like RA/9 instead of ERA, and we'll calculate OAV and WHIP with errors counting as hits to get a true feel for how teams are impacted since the effect of errors doesn't show up in the traditional pitching stats (ERA/OAV/WHIP).
• How many more errors will a team of deadball pitchers allow over a team of modern pitchers?
• What effect will the increase of errors (if any) have on team performance?
• How big of an advantage (if any) do teams with deadball pitchers have over teams with modern pitchers?
• Have fun!

Here's how it will play out:
24 teams (12 owners with 2 teams each):
Salary: $80 million
AAA: No
WW: No
Clones: Allowed
Trades: No
DH: No

TEAM COMPOSITION:
Every owner submits two teams.

Offense: Both teams must share the same offense. You can draft whatever hitters you want, but both your teams must have identical offenses. At least 1,000 PA must have a HR/100# of 5 or greater (to account for and see/incorporate the value deadball pitchers provide in HR suppression).

Pitching: One of your two teams can only draft pitchers from 1888-1919 and the other can only draft pitchers from 1985-2016 (to keep people from taking advantage of 2017-2020 not using dynamic pricing and upsetting the value test. Plus that leaves 31 seasons of pitching options for both rosters).

BALLPARK: Any ballpark may be used, but both teams must use the same ballpark.

ALIGNMENT: There will be two different "groups" for the test. Group A (Deadball Pitchers) and Group B (Modern Pitchers), 12 teams each. Each league will have 6 of each group, each division will have 2 of each group. Each owner will have 1 team in each league. Alignment will be random and adjusted, if necessary, to meet the conditions set above.

Signups:
1. Just4Me
2. Contrarian23
3. Chargingryno
4. Milest
5. Fatguyrd
6. Redcped
7. Jfranco77
8. Schwarze
9. Skinndogg
10. Jtvaughey
11. Doctorkz
12. Teamhydro


Sitemail list: Chargingryno, Contrarian23, Doctorkz, Fatguyrd, Jfranco77, Jtvaughey, Just4me, Milest, Redcped, Schwarze, Skinndogg, Teamhydro

Love this idea, and it is EXACTLY in keeping with what I intended with the TWISL concept. Thanks for doing this.

I'll play.

My opinion is that the time period from which a pitcher comes from doesn't matter as much as the quality of that pitcher. If a deadballer gives up a couple of errors that maybe shouldn't be, it doesn't matter if he's 'good enough'. The same for modern guys- if he gives up a few solo shots, it doesn't really matter if he's 'good enough'

I think the strategy is in the 'type' of pitchers you use- and certain types of pitchers 'usually' come from the same time periods.

I don't play much at lower caps, but at certain cap levels, you can predict what the opponents' batting orders will look like, thus make optimal pitcher selections.

although, I do feel like this test will be beneficial (although there have been leagues with similar rules concerning time periods/pitching- and we already know that it IS a fact that deadballers give up more errors)- I feel like it will only be specific to $80M leagues with 2 HR hitters required on each team. I play in leagues at every cap level & rarely even have 1 guy at HR# 5+, much less 2, so the data won't necessarily be indicative of a random league where the typical strategy is to not even care about having power in your lineup. In other words, if 1 era does better than the other era, it may not really mean anything to a $140M cap league with no restrictions...but...

I'll play!!!

Posted by milest on 1/15/2021 1:12:00 PM (view original):
I'll play.

My opinion is that the time period from which a pitcher comes from doesn't matter as much as the quality of that pitcher. If a deadballer gives up a couple of errors that maybe shouldn't be, it doesn't matter if he's 'good enough'. The same for modern guys- if he gives up a few solo shots, it doesn't really matter if he's 'good enough'

I think the strategy is in the 'type' of pitchers you use- and certain types of pitchers 'usually' come from the same time periods.

I don't play much at lower caps, but at certain cap levels, you can predict what the opponents' batting orders will look like, thus make optimal pitcher selections.

although, I do feel like this test will be beneficial (although there have been leagues with similar rules concerning time periods/pitching- and we already know that it IS a fact that deadballers give up more errors)- I feel like it will only be specific to $80M leagues with 2 HR hitters required on each team. I play in leagues at every cap level & rarely even have 1 guy at HR# 5+, much less 2, so the data won't necessarily be indicative of a random league where the typical strategy is to not even care about having power in your lineup. In other words, if 1 era does better than the other era, it may not really mean anything to a $140M cap league with no restrictions...but...

I'll play!!!

I agree with most of what you’re saying here. I do think the HR effect will be interesting as it relates to the value of the deadball pitchers. My original lineup idea did not have the HR requirement and I didn’t draft HRs. Most of the HR avoidance stems from the anticipation of deadball HR suppression. If we can also quantify that impact in terms of overall value difference relative to modern pitchers, it might help solidify the current anti-HR strategy or lend credence to the effect not being as strong as it appears and increase the number of HR hitters drafted.

Welcome!

Sign me up

That makes 5, just need 7 more!

I learn a lot from these leagues, so I'll join. I might need a few days to get the teams built, but since we're only half full it might not be a rush.

Halfway there!

And, no rush at this point. I won’t start pestering people to get their teams in until after it’s full.

Getting my rosters built. This is more fun and more challenging than I thought. I have a bias against deadballers so I'm not as familiar with good players in that era

I definitely had fun building these rosters. Somewhat different from my normal team building.

I've been really busy. I've neglected a couple of teams that need micromanagement....

I haven't built the deadball staff yet, but my fielders are awful.

Just putting it out there that if anyone only wanted to have one team in this league, I'd be happy to work with someone to agree on an offense and then each pick our pitching staffs and split the teams up.

Posted by redcped on 1/19/2021 1:45:00 PM (view original):
Just putting it out there that if anyone only wanted to have one team in this league, I'd be happy to work with someone to agree on an offense and then each pick our pitching staffs and split the teams up.

If people agree to work together that way, I'm ok with it, just make sure to communicate with me on it so when I'm verifying rosters, I know which two go together.

I'm not a huge fan of running 2 teams in a league but I really like the data we get, so you can sign me up for two.

If we fill up, I'd be happy to split a pair of teams with Red.

I understand, and am glad to have you!